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Should the south side of the orange line be extended from Forrest Hills to Norwood?
I've heard about the Orange Line being extended to West Roxbury, and as far away as Needham. Personally, I don't believe that it's necessary to do so since Forest Hills serves as an intermodal transit hub for subway trains, commuter trains, buses, and if the MBTA wishes to do so, a light rail on the former Arborway staton.
That's really the decision of the residents of the aforementioned communities as to whether they'd prefer to see the Orange Line to go as far away as Needham, and Norwood, and since those communities tend to be more suburban, it seems like they're going to prefer the less frequent commuter rail over subway because it's all about who's going to utilize the rail and at what frequency.
I don't agree with people who are arguing that we should expand the Blue Line to Lynn. Lynn already has commuter rail running through the middle of downtown - if they could upgrade, electrify and increase frequency of the Newburyport/Rockport line, I believe that will be sufficient.
If I could wave a magic wand and make improvements to the system, here's what I'd do:
1. North South Rail and electrification of the entire commuter rail seems to be the most important transit upgrade for the entire system.
2. Silver Line bus tunnel at South Station. People taking the Silver Line from Roxbury should be able to make it to the airport without having to switch at South Station.
3. Blue Line extension to the Red line and possibly beyond.
4. High speed or higher speed rail all the way to Albany. I know that we may get it to Springfield, or even Pittsfield, but why stop there?
5. I'm still waiting to see the results of Baker's bill that forces communities to build higher density housing around public transit - If nothing comes of it, I'd like to see a more serious bill with more teeth in the near future.
6. I like the idea of the Silver Line to Everett - I realize it may be under construction/in talks now, but I hope that doesn't fizzle out. I'd also like to see more BRT type transit that goes deeper into the suburbs.
I don't agree with people who are arguing that we should expand the Blue Line to Lynn. Lynn already has commuter rail running through the middle of downtown - if they could upgrade, electrify and increase frequency of the Newburyport/Rockport line, I believe that will be sufficient.
Extending the Blue line to Lynn has been talked about since the 1920's (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_L...ension_to_Lynn), practically a century. There's a commuter link between Lynn and Boston but I don't believe it's used because of the cost to travel to Boston, the difficulty of transferring to the subway lines, and the frequency of the service.
Extending the Blue Line would ease the possibility of transferring into any T line, especially if the Charles/MGH extension goes through, plus a frequency of 10 minutes each way and the more affordable cost would make the Blue line much more utilized than the commuter line.
We can agree to disagree, but I see the Blue line as a much better option due to those reasons!
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Originally Posted by MrDee12345
If I could wave a magic wand and make improvements to the system, here's what I'd do:
1. North South Rail and electrification of the entire commuter rail seems to be the most important transit upgrade for the entire system.
If the Big Dig was a costly endeavor, the Big Dig 2 might be even more costly, especially if you were to dig underneath the expressway. I'd rather have another subway line or extend a subway line than call for another Big Dig!
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Originally Posted by MrDee12345
2. Silver Line bus tunnel at South Station. People taking the Silver Line from Roxbury should be able to make it to the airport without having to switch at South Station.
Sounds good and hopefully the MBTA can do it.
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Originally Posted by MrDee12345
3. Blue Line extension to the Red line and possibly beyond.
I've heard of the Blue line being extended as far as Kenmore, and after Kenmore, I'm not sure how far it will go. The Green Line seems to do it's job providing transit coverage west of Kenmore and the Red Line is a workhorse for the MBTA can could be extended to Arlington as a subway.
The problem with this aspect is that in order to transfer, you'd have to travel to downtown Boston to travel from one line to the next, and the system works like that just fine. Extending to Charles/MGH is perfect for the Blue line, and before we talk about congestion inside the trains, why not expand the train sets from 6 to 8 train cars while we're at it?
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Originally Posted by MrDee12345
4. High speed or higher speed rail all the way to Albany. I know that we may get it to Springfield, or even Pittsfield, but why stop there?
There has to be a major priority to get from Boston to Albany via HSR and I believe that it's much more of a possibility to make an HSR route connecting Montreal via NH & VT or even Maine and the Maritime provinces of Canada than to Albany.
It's still possible, but only way to do so would be to build a new ROW since you can't use the current ROW due to the curves and bottlenecks plus it's only two-track from Boston to Worcester, which means that you'll find resistance from property and business owners whose property may be in the path of the proposed route. Plus Albany isn't a major city like Boston, NYC, Montreal, or Philadelphia, so a HSR link connecting Boston and Albany isn't a huge priority.
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Originally Posted by MrDee12345
5. I'm still waiting to see the results of Baker's bill that forces communities to build higher density housing around public transit - If nothing comes of it, I'd like to see a more serious bill with more teeth in the near future.
TOD's would be much more successful in cities such as Boston and the smaller cities of Cambridge, Somerville, Everett, Revere, Chelsea, and Lynn. Suburban communities may push back on denser TODs. Less dense TODs can work for suburbs, but the more dense ones aren't going to fly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrDee12345
6. I like the idea of the Silver Line to Everett - I realize it may be under construction/in talks now, but I hope that doesn't fizzle out. I'd also like to see more BRT type transit that goes deeper into the suburbs.
The city of Boston is already building BRT and while I was never a believer of BRT in the beginning, I've embraced Boston's BRT plans along Columbus Ave, Washington St, and hopefully Blue Hill Ave, Warren St, Dorchester Ave, and Massachusetts Ave.
I don't agree with people who are arguing that we should expand the Blue Line to Lynn. Lynn already has commuter rail running through the middle of downtown - if they could upgrade, electrify and increase frequency of the Newburyport/Rockport line, I believe that will be sufficient.
The same argument could have been made for Quincy before the addition of the Red Line which is a similar size city, a similar distance from Downtown Boston. Today, it’s hard to imagine Quincy with only commuter rail service. It’s also hard to deny the amount of investment that’s been funneled into Quincy around the Red Line. I think Lynn deserves the same. Id even argue that downtown Lynn has better bones than Quincy. Id also question the ability of the MBTA to deliver anything resembling rapid transit frequencies on the Commuter Rail, even with fully electrification and the N/S Link. A Blue Line extension also connects Lynn and more of Revere (where many of Logan’s tens of thousands of workers live) directly to the airport. In my opinion, Lynn absolutely has the population density and proximity to Boston to support a rapid transit connection. Talks of a Salem extension are a little more questionable.
The same argument could have been made for Quincy before the addition of the Red Line which is a similar size city, a similar distance from Downtown Boston. Today, it’s hard to imagine Quincy with only commuter rail service. It’s also hard to deny the amount of investment that’s been funneled into Quincy around the Red Line. I think Lynn deserves the same. Id even argue that downtown Lynn has better bones than Quincy. Id also question the ability of the MBTA to deliver anything resembling rapid transit frequencies on the Commuter Rail, even with fully electrification and the N/S Link. A Blue Line extension also connects Lynn and more of Revere (where many of Logan’s tens of thousands of workers live) directly to the airport. In my opinion, Lynn absolutely has the population density and proximity to Boston to support a rapid transit connection. Talks of a Salem extension are a little more questionable.
We can wonder what if the red Line didn't expand all the way to Quincy and Braintree? Never really ventured into Quincy and only time I was there was when the chinatown bus somehow stopped there as I woke up in the bus and noted a T station nearby the bus station. Since it was nighttime, I didn't have time to venture out and took the Red Line to Downtown.
As for a Blue Line extension, extending to Salem is very superfluous, Lynn is a perfect potential transit hub that can be transformed into a TOD inside downtown Lynn. Salem is a less dense historic city which doesn't really need the densification due to the history associated with the Salem Witch Trials. The Blue Line to Lynn has to be the biggest priority for the MBTA after the GLX has been officially completed.
No the biggest priority for the MBTA "has" to be to fix the broken down system they are already obligated to. Nobody who has to rely on this mess of system every day, gives a crap about your wide eyed "expansion" fantasies.
No the biggest priority for the MBTA "has" to be to fix the broken down system they are already obligated to. Nobody who has to rely on this mess of system every day, gives a crap about your wide eyed "expansion" fantasies.
And I'm agreeing with you on fixing the T, nobody's denying fixing the T to improved standards. Plus, they're not my "expansion fantasies" nor did I create these lines, but the powers that be ever since the 1920's proposed that these plans happen. There's a huge difference in what I've "created" and what other people back a century ago, I'm just following those plans those past us have enacted!!!
Probably the only people that don't care about expanding and improving the T are the people that want to use their cars just to get to Boston from Middlesex, Plymouth, and Essex Counties, and RI & NH. Those people are the ones with the "fantasies" that everything gonna last forever and that the Big Dig is enough!
The T needs to be fixed from the inside out, no question about it, but how about expanding as well as improving the infrastructure. It makes a lot more sense to return services such as Watertown and Arborway on the Green Line so people don't have to use cars or even overuse the bus routes. I believe that the T's priority should be to increase frequency (more trains) and the only way you're going to have to do so is to create more routes as well as fixing the infrastructure.
And I'm agreeing with you on fixing the T, nobody's denying fixing the T to improved standards. Plus, they're not my "expansion fantasies" nor did I create these lines, but the powers that be ever since the 1920's proposed that these plans happen. There's a huge difference in what I've "created" and what other people back a century ago, I'm just following those plans those past us have enacted!!!
Probably the only people that don't care about expanding and improving the T are the people that want to use their cars just to get to Boston from Middlesex, Plymouth, and Essex Counties, and RI & NH. Those people are the ones with the "fantasies" that everything gonna last forever and that the Big Dig is enough!
The T needs to be fixed from the inside out, no question about it, but how about expanding as well as improving the infrastructure. It makes a lot more sense to return services such as Watertown and Arborway on the Green Line so people don't have to use cars or even overuse the bus routes. I believe that the T's priority should be to increase frequency (more trains) and the only way you're going to have to do so is to create more routes as well as fixing the infrastructure.
First of all, nobody around here refers to counties so you should refrain from such if you want to avoid confusing people with you incorrect assumptions.
As for everything else, no that's not how it works. You need to get your house in order and prove to have the responsibility and ability to manage what you currently have, before looking to expand your footprint. You don't expect mom and dad to give you a new puppy for Christmas when the hamster has proven too much for you. Handing more money to a bunch of drunken sailors will not end well under any scenario. The Watertown and Arborway lines are a perfect example of wide eyed fantasies. The T has long abandoned them as unfeasible given the non-existent right of ways. Buses are the appropriate solution there.
First of all, nobody around here refers to counties so you should refrain from such if you want to avoid confusing people with you incorrect assumptions.
As for everything else, no that's not how it works. You need to get your house in order and prove to have the responsibility and ability to manage what you currently have, before looking to expand your footprint. You don't expect mom and dad to give you a new puppy for Christmas when the hamster has proven too much for you. Handing more money to a bunch of drunken sailors will not end well under any scenario. The Watertown and Arborway lines are a perfect example of wide eyed fantasies. The T has long abandoned them as unfeasible given the non-existent right of ways. Buses are the appropriate solution there.
You're right about managing what you currently have, but I also feel that it has very little to do with expansion and more to do with the MBTA's upkeep and maintenance. You've had ties and rail that haven't been changed not just for a years, but even decades and that's just the problem with the MBTA's maintenance division and it doesn't need to be investigated because one wrong step, and you could've had a major accident which would've costed not just a lot of money, but people's lives.
The "wide-eyed fantasies" were actually realities at one time, when people had to take the trolleys to Kenmore, Back Bay, and Downtown before the automobile slowly, but surely, replaced the Arborway and Watertown lines. I kinda believe that the T doesn't want to be a better system, and it's not the system that's the problem, but the people who are running the T and the people who maintain and repair the system that needs to be checked. They also needs to be terminations for the people responsible for the delayed maintenance. Another problem seems to be an entrenched culture of not doing the maintenance but checking it as complete, anyways, which is why the T system is in the condition it's in!
You need to understand the political and cultural history of this state as it relates to the MBTA, to fully appreciate all the issues in play here. You do not. You have an academic understanding of some of the transit issues. I think some people have tried to communicate that but it seems to go in one ear and out the other.
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