From NorCal to SoCal? Seeking input from SoCal folks (Los Angeles: real estate market, renting)
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So I've lived in NorCal most of my life, from the SF Bay Area to the Sacramento area now. I also single and have a steady job CA State job that will cap out at just below 6 figures. If I seek advancement, I can expect an additional $12-20K or so.
I'm drawn to live by the ocean. Not necessarily an ocean front property but something located close enough where I can have views of it. I also like the breeze and ocean air that comes from being in close proximity to it. My ideal is to take advantage of it and the scenery, enjoy regular walks/jogs/bike rides, access to pretty much all the shops I'd ever want/need access to, low crime, clean, well managed, with good schools in case I ever start a family and have kids.
I'd be content with a nice, well-situated 2-3bd/2ba/2car condo with a view, maybe maxing out just under $550K-$600K, at most. That could be attainable for me if I sell my current property.
If I were to enjoy greater prosperity down the road, I could look at a nice home, perhaps. But in the near term, I think the above would be reasonably attainable and more realistic.
My expectations would be that I could enjoy good air quality and scenic backdrops while engaged in day-to-day activities, from work, to running errands, recreational activities, and etc. It'd be an integral part of my every day life and enhanced daily enjoyment. I would have little worry about crime, safety, vandalism, and etc.
That said, some areas of concern I have are:
1. Finding a CA State job (currently IT related) in SoCal in one of the desirable beach towns. I'd really like
to eliminate or minimize my commute to/from work. I'd say 15 minutes one way or less would be
pretty decent. Anything 30 mins or longer may be something I'd like to avoid. Anything walking or
biking distance, or teleworking would be even better.
If there are no viable CA State jobs that I can apply for to transfer/relocate to SoCal, I'm wondering
what other viable options I'd have in order to maintain at least the salary I currently make. I am
unfamiliar with what federal jobs would be available that would fit my geographical and commute
criteria, or if they'd pay as well.
If not federal jobs, with county/city jobs would be viable? Or would I have to look at re-entering the
private sector?
2. Whether moving to a more affluent community would necessarily mean being surrounded by more
snobby, materialistic and shallow people or not. I'd like to try to find a happy middle ground. I
would think that my happiness would partly depend on the kinds of people available to socialize with
and to develop relationships with. I have no experience with what the day-to-day experience would
be like.. whether I'd necessarily find myself in a more conservative crowd, etc.
3. I have a problem with smog levels in the LAX area and have found that it has a negative affect on me
when I just arrive to LAX from elsewhere. I can notice the difference in my lungs and what not.
Hoping living in one of the beach town areas would enable me to avoid most of that.
4. For those who have lived in both NorCal and SoCal, could you share your own experiences and observed
pros and cons to each? I'd like to see if there are any considerations I may be overlooking. I would
like a place that I can live in for the rest of my work life (40's, 50's, 60's) and also into retirement.
Areas I'm interested in include Laguna Beach, Newport Beach, Aliso Viejo, Dana Point. I've been told
Long Beach, while not as nice, may be one of the more remaining "affordable" places by the ocean side.
I prefer an area not always crowded and trashed by tourists, has plenty of liveliness, shops and activities, and is well maintained and aesthetically pleasing.
If anyone has some input on any of the above, it'd be greatly appreciated.
I'm just exploring the possibilities and want to determine if the move would bring the lifestyle enhancements I would expect or not, to make it worthwhile.
It's hard to know where the "state" jobs are located. Mostly in Sactown. If you're looking for coastal and affordable, the CDC has a place up in Crescent City (Del Norte Co.) that probably needs at least some IT staff. They also have facilities in the San Luis Obispo area.
Otherwise, I'd look in northern San Diego Co perhaps, the Oceanside area. The only sate jobs I'm aware of in your preferred area (Dana Point, Laguna Beach) are going to be CalTrans, and their offices are in either Santa Ana or they have "yards" in Costa Mesa under the 73 at Bristol St and right next to the old El Toro Marine Base at Sand Canyon and the I-5 Fwy in Irvine. FWIW, you will not find much in the DP / LB areas for $500K. Maybe the condos in Laguna Woods if you are of age. Aliso Viejo may have some. The only ones I can think of in DP are the ones at the corner of Niguel Rd and Camino Del Avion (Ritz Pointe community, on Corniche Dr.), they run around $520K, but expect a steep HOA and a very small place. Still, the area is everything - Gorgeous walk to beach along very green roads on wide sidewalks, or the path through the Monarch Beach resort to the sand (formerly the St. Regis, Monarch Beach).
I also think you are biggest hurdle will be your budget. Especially in coastal Southern California, you'll have hard time finding a two or three bedroom townhome or condo in that price range as close to the ocean as you would like. I can think of a few pockets in San Diego where you might be able to meet that budget with modest expectations, about 20 minutes drive from the ocean but someone farther inland. So I think housing will be your biggest challenge. Nevertheless, I'm happy to give you some ideas on neighborhoods in San Diego County that could fit that bill if you were flexible on location. And honestly, I think that you will need to become flexible, because your wishlist as a short commute, proximity to the ocean, and a low price is honestly and unrealistic combination. That being said, I am intimately familiar with the San Diego real estate market, somewhat familiar with Orange County, and not very familiar with Los Angeles. Since you mentioned the area around LAX, I'm hoping someone from the surrounding area maybe it was chime in on real estate prices in that area. Los Angeles does get considerably more smog than, say, Ventura to the North or San Diego to the South, and the congestion in Los Angeles is the worst in the region, making commuting a particularly hellish experience.
I do think the above responder has a good suggestion of looking at Oceanside in Northern San Diego County. Since you prefer a non tourist area reasonable pricing, that may be one of the few areas in Southern California that fits the bill. Oceanside is not the most beautiful city but is definitely up and coming, has a booming hipster food scene, and housing is relatively affordable not too terribly far from the ocean. I see a lot of long-term upside in that area. There is a lot of military around there, but I'm not sure about state job opportunities. There is a very large conglomeration of private companies and jobs in the Carlsbad area, just to the South.
YouTube mention Long Beach, which I think is another fantastic suggestion! I was just there last fall for the first time in years and we were quite impressed by how vibrant and beautiful the downtown is. Lots of historic buildings with lots of restaurants and nightlife, quite a few highrises, and lots of charming storage victorians in the neighborhoods surrounding the downtown. It actually gave us a real Sacramento type vibe in terms of density, architecture, and neighborhood demographic, only with a waterfront to boot. You also have reasonable proximity to Los Angeles for weekend exploration oh, and you are not far from the Palos Verdes peninsula just to the north and west, which has some of the most beautiful, unspoiled, rugged Coastal scenery in Southern California.
All in all, I think your everyday life is pretty much the same everywhere. People go to work, they buy groceries, they run errands, they go to dinner, that sort of thing. You will not find many conservative people in coastal Southern California, and especially Los Angeles extremely liberal and most closely parallels San Francisco and Oakland in its voting patterns. The rest of coastal Southern California is moderately but solidly liberal in my opinion.
One last thing to consider regarding the timing of your purchase would be weather cannot you would be paying cash. If you would be financing your transaction, then sooner maybe better because of rising interest rates reducing purchasing power over time. On the other hand, if you are looking to purchase cash, and you may wish to see how things play out in the year ahead and avoid the spring and summer bump before looking to buy in fall or winter while prices are expected to flatten or slightly drop.
I lived in LA for 15 years - not near the coast though. I worked for the State, (specifically the UC system), for most of that time. Not sure how it is in the IT profession, but in my line of work, there was much more money as well as benefits/retirement in NorCal.
20 years ago I got a job at a local municipal agency in Silicon Valley and it was the best move of my life. I have a much better retirement than I ever would have had had I stayed with UC in SoCal.
Point is, there are a lot of municipal agencies that pay better and have better benefits than the state. So look at some of the City HR sites. They all need IT help. Also, if you're working for a Muni Agency or the State, the closer you get to retirement the more you'll appreciate that monthly pension. Believe me, it's a big deal. Defined Benefit plans are disappearing rapidly in the private sector.
Sorry I can't help you on coastal real estate prices, but I think the amount you mentioned is going to be a bit low. Still, is it really all the bad if you have to live a few miles from the coast? I lived in Echo Park area not too far from Dodger Stadium, but I used to drive out to Santa Monica all the time. You get used to it.
I'd be content with a nice, well-situated 2-3bd/2ba/2car condo with a view, maybe maxing out just under $550K-$600K, at most. That could be attainable for me if I sell my current property...
Areas I'm interested in include Laguna Beach, Newport Beach, Aliso Viejo, Dana Point. I've been told
Long Beach, while not as nice, may be one of the more remaining "affordable" places by the ocean side.
I prefer an area not always crowded and trashed by tourists, has plenty of liveliness, shops and activities, and is well maintained and aesthetically pleasing.
If anyone has some input on any of the above, it'd be greatly appreciated.
I doubt that you will find anything in your price range in either Laguna Beach or Newport Beach, but I don't know of something might be available in Dana Point.
Aliso Viejo is not a beach city, but since it's right next to Laguna Beach, getting to the ocean is usually pretty easy and quick.
Regarding state IT jobs, I can't help you with that search, but Irvine, and to some extent, Aliso Viejo, have tech jobs. From what I have been reading on C-D, they likely pay far less than one would get in the Bay area.
I grew up in coastal SoCal and lived there most of my life. Most of our family is still in San Diego. Worked IT there, also out of state (CO) and now in Monterey. We get lots of folks who go back and forth between SJ/SF, Santa Cruz and Monterey.
There are some significant differences between NorCal and SoCal - too many to go over in any single post. So I'll mainly address the job scene as well as coastal living.
Work: there are plenty of IT related jobs in SoCal in both private and public sectors. For public sector you have everything from local, state and federal as well as working as a contractor for these organizations. There are many private sector jobs also from smaller companies to larger corporations. *Generally speaking* this is similar to NorCal. However, for public sector work I think you'll find more in NorCal obviously at the state level and possibly more at the county and city levels. Those will vary more depending on who's hiring at any given time. Federal level may be a wash with a slight advantage to SoCal. There is a pretty good aerospace, DoD segment in SoCal due to the military presence in SD and LA.
The big thing to consider is that SoCal just feels more dense in terms of the population. And that's because it is to the tune of ~24 million residents. From San Diego, OC, LA to the San Fernando Valley you have a huge wall of people or a concrete jungle. And guess what? They all need jobs (beyond those retried, wealthy, etc...). And guess what else? The majority want to live along the coast if they can find any way to do that. The coast is the place to be for the best weather, excellent beaches, activities, air quality, etc... Additionally, unlike NorCal, Socal has 'the industry' with all the people who flock there from around the world to try to get in. That leads to some heavy competition for housing and work especially for what some consider 'cushy' public sector jobs with excellent benefits including retirement.
Coastal living: First of all inland LA, LAX, etc... is nothing like coastal LA when it comes to smog and general air quality. If you head over to places like the South Bay (Manhattan Beach, Redondo Beach, Palos Verdes, etc...) the air is excellent the majority of the year due to the predominant 'onshore' ocean air flow. That goes for the rest of the coast down to to SD. Don't confuse coastal air quality with the rest of inland SoCal. They are two entirely different beasts due to the millions of inhabitants and all their pollutants which flow freely inland and get then trapped. This is another reason most want to live at the coast even if they won't say it. But coastal living comes at a very high premium as a result of this. This is similar to coastal SF, Santa Cruz, Monterey, Carmel vs. the Central Valley. There's a huge difference there on many levels.
Now figure out how to get a high paying public sector job near the coast and you'll be ahead of millions of others wanting the same exact thing. That's not to say you won't be able to do it. Just be aware there is lots of competition and sometimes applicants who know people already working there which really helps their cause. Then there is the cost of housing which is high. Just go onto Zillow and Redfin and see it for yourself. The closer you get to the water's edge the quicker the prices rise. As you get further away from the main economic hubs the prices are a little better though certainly not cheap. North SD County or Ventura County may be your best bets for near coastal living. That said, no one on CD is going to be able to tell you where you'll find high paying job near the coast though. Only you can determine that through an extensive job search.
Derek
Last edited by MtnSurfer; 12-30-2018 at 12:55 AM..
Look at Oxnard/Port Hueneme/Ventura areas. You might squeak by there with your budget. Ventura is the county seat and there are county jobs, and a few state jobs, and there's a state college in Camarillo. For local jobs, check here, all the VC cities and the county websites are listed:
OP wants a
2 or 3 bedroom condo
ocean view
upscale, desirable beach city
not over-run with tourists
less than $600K
Doesn't exist anymore. You're gonna need a time machine to achieve what you're looking for.
Your only options are to either increase your budget dramatically or eliminate the ocean view/beach city part and look inland.
Yes, when you combine all of the above with a high paying public sector job it becomes more unrealistic or fantasy like. Though it doesn't hurt to dream. Basically pick two of these three given the criteria mentioned:
1. Buying a 2-3 BR condo < $600K
2. Live near the beach with an ocean view
3. Live in a nice area with good schools, low crime and a good paying public sector job not too far from home
OP, since you're from NorCal try to imagine all you're asking for along the NorCal coast with an ocean view. The only place you 'might' find that is if you go all the way up to Humboldt. But then you'll need the good paying job to go along with it, something which is in very low supply in the Emerald Triangle. By contrast, if you move to Santa Cruz or Pacifica how hard do you think it would be to find a condo under $600K AND the job nearby to go with it.
More realistically you'll be renting if right along the coast. I love the coast, so I know, understand and have experienced what you're looking for. It's a QOL question, really. To obtain that QOL you'll have to give up some things to gain something else. What is really more important to you if you can not have everything? That is something you should think long and hard about. Only you can make that decision.
BTW, we made the same decision over a decade ago when moving to Monterey and it was totally worth it! But now we're in a different life stage after raising kids here. And we would do it all over again if given the same choices. Here's a recent photo from our window where we've enjoyed more sunsets over the ocean than I can count just steps from the beach.
Derek
Last edited by MtnSurfer; 12-30-2018 at 02:36 PM..
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