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I used to be very firmly anti Quebec nationalism. I still don’t agree with it, but I realize how effective it has been in some things. All government services should be accessible in French, I 100% agree with that. French education should be accessible to everyone and encouraged, again I 100% agree.
I disagree with many things like Bill 101, Bill 21, Charter of values, more recent legislation etc which I think I can argue are unnecessary to preserve Quebec’s Francophone culture. Still though, sometimes the pendulum has to swing a certain direction to achieve a (hopefully for me) more relaxed future landscape of laws and regulations. Hard to argue with its success though when there’s a flourishing community of 6 million people speaking a language that has had its odds stacked against it. If this kept on going as they were in the 1950s, who knows what Quebec would be like today. Could be like Hamburg, Germany where no one speaks the local low German language anymore as an example.
I’ve learned some stuff about different parts of the world that have been struggling with preserving French. I could be wrong on this, but apparently according to some articles I read the younger generation in the Caribbean islands of St Lucia and Dominica is majority English speaking now in what have long been French speaking islands and the native French creole languages are only spoken by the older generations and by young people in rural areas. This kind of reminds me of how standard Italian and German have basically taken over their respective countries which once had various local dialects that are poorly understood by young urban residents today. I hope they can turn things around.
It’s hard to really compare the situation in Canada with many places because the European countries I’m aware of with multiple languages also have pretty strict language laws like Belgium and parts of Spain. Apparently Cameroon is split English/French but that would be as a second language or language of business, as first languages for most people would be African languages. I think India is similar with how the North speaks Hindi and the South speaks English as a common language between ethnic groups.
I’m not sure what the way forward is but it would be nice in my opinion if we can form a common national Canadian identity where language is unimportant because everyone will be fluent in both English and French. We need to figure something out for that. Anglos need to embrace francophone culture more for that to happen. People on Curaçao can speak 4 languages and probably enjoy media and cultural influences from all of them, I think as Canadians we can handle 2.
You admire how Quebec has been able to maintain their language and culture yet call everything they did to preserve it "unnecessary". Quebec is a success precisely because of the steps they have taken, They take pride in their heritage. If it wasn't for these things, French language and culture would be much weaker now.
French language is dieing out in the rest of Canada.
Last edited by Luisito80; 05-08-2024 at 07:36 PM..
Probably the only way to achieve full bilingualism in Canada would be to have all children from English-speaking families attend French immersion schools, and vice versa. That would work, eventually, but the logistics would be terrible. I’m sure there aren’t even close to enough French-speaking elementary school teachers to make that happen.
Probably the only way to achieve full bilingualism in Canada would be to have all children from English-speaking families attend French immersion schools, and vice versa. That would work, eventually, but the logistics would be terrible. I’m sure there aren’t even close to enough French-speaking elementary school teachers to make that happen.
In BC, all students are required to study a second language from grades 5 to 8, as per the Language Education Policy. And they may choose French as an elective thereafter.
In BC, all students are required to study a second language from grades 5 to 8, as per the Language Education Policy. And they may choose French as an elective thereafter.
As all of us who took three or four years of a second language know, this is unfortunately not remotely the same as immersion. If it were, everyone in BC would be bilingual.
I’m not saying French-English bilingualism should be the goal for all Canadians. But if it were, immersion starting in grade 1 would be the way to achieve it.
Probably the only way to achieve full bilingualism in Canada would be to have all children from English-speaking families attend French immersion schools, and vice versa. That would work, eventually, but the logistics would be terrible. I’m sure there aren’t even close to enough French-speaking elementary school teachers to make that happen.
Excellent idea. Yea, it’s hard to learn a language when you have no one to speak with in that language. It’s frustrating that education is a provincial issue because encouraging French use doesn’t seem to be a priority in the ROC (rest of Canada). I imagine small town primary schools are dwindling in enrolment throughout Quebec as the population ages. Some sort of rotational exchange student program, where an Anglo kid takes classes in Quebec for a month or two and they waive assignments missed and take the marks from Quebec maybe. That kind of stuff should be important for our country in maintaining national unity. I really like your idea.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarisaAnna
To be honest, when we were in Quebec we were surprised how bad the general standard of English seemed to be.
I’d have to disagree. In smaller towns you might stop in on a road trip, it’s not always easy to communicate effectively in English, but they’re way better still than French knowledge even large cities in the Rest of Canada. Most anglos even somewhere like Ottawa would just stare at you blankly if you tried to speak to them in French. That doesn’t really happen with English in Quebec unless you’re talking to like a 96 year old farmer from St Georges. I’ve travelled to a few countries in Central and South America and outside of people in the tourism industry, it’s much harder to communicate with locals in English than Quebec.
Probably the only way to achieve full bilingualism in Canada would be to have all children from English-speaking families attend French immersion schools, and vice versa. That would work, eventually, but the logistics would be terrible. I’m sure there aren’t even close to enough French-speaking elementary school teachers to make that happen.
What would be the point of such an exercise? The French taught in Canadian schools is nothing like the actual French language spoken in France. I live in the GTA and the only time I hear French is if I put on CPAC or the Environment Canada automated weather forecast on the radio. I took French in school from grade 6 to grade 9, passed every year and cannot speak a word of it. Most people I know can't speak a word of it. I know more Spanish than French probably because it is far more useful when I travel down south.
So other than appeasing Quebec, what would be the point of French immersion for everyone? It's not like Canadian French is a language of commerce spoken worldwide. Outside of Canada, very few places speak it (if any). In that sense it is about as useful as Irish Gaelic (which is probably a far better example of language preservation in the world). Would teaching Canadian children basic economics and money management not be a far better use of our tax dollars?
What would be the point of such an exercise? The French taught in Canadian schools is nothing like the actual French language spoken in France. I live in the GTA and the only time I hear French is if I put on CPAC or the Environment Canada automated weather forecast on the radio. I took French in school from grade 6 to grade 9, passed every year and cannot speak a word of it. Most people I know can't speak a word of it. I know more Spanish than French probably because it is far more useful when I travel down south.
So other than appeasing Quebec, what would be the point of French immersion for everyone? It's not like Canadian French is a language of commerce spoken worldwide. Outside of Canada, very few places speak it (if any). In that sense it is about as useful as Irish Gaelic (which is probably a far better example of language preservation in the world). Would teaching Canadian children basic economics and money management not be a far better use of our tax dollars?
I have no horse in this race (I'm not Canadian), but was just responding to the OP who would like to see all Canadians equally bilingual. IF that were the goal, that would be the most successful approach, long-term, to reach it.
Your language-learning experience is typical of most of us. Frankly, as personally enriching as it is to speak another language, being bilingual is of minimal use to most native English speakers, and so the motivation to reach a high level is low.
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Quebec is a success precisely because of the steps they have taken, They take pride in their heritage. If it wasn't for these things, French language and culture would be much weaker now.