Douglas County School Board (Denver, Center: low income, 2015, purchase)

[Calix]

Originally Posted by SkyDog77

My tax dollars should not be spent on teaching your kid that Jesus rode a T-Rex.

You probably fancied yourself so clever with that hateful remark. Did it make you feel good to degrade?

Pretty easy to bully and ridicule Christians right

You might even have a clever Christian bashing bumper sticker on your car.

Of course a brave person like you wouldn't post a Mohammed cartoon or put something mocking Mohammed on your car, but that's 'cause Muslims fight back.

When you say religion, you mostly only mean one belief, Christianity. That's why that's the first place you went. Predictable as the day is long.

[davidv]

Originally Posted by eaton place

Because the folks involved keep denying ties, is why

Funding is a non-issue. The school board incumbents are funded by right-wing ideologists and the their opponents are funded by left-wing ideologists. Case closed.

Originally Posted by eaton place

From a mechanics standpoint, do you not like healthy competition?
Do not more choices make for better offerings, in general, due to competition for a customer base?

This is part of the free market myth that the right has been perpetuating for years. The idea that competition is a panacea for education is misguided, at best.

1. Competition works only if all people have equal access to the service. Access to private schools is restricted by:

-- Ability to pay. Even with a voucher, most students' families cannot afford to send their children to private school.

-- Geographical access. Most private schools do not offer transportation, so it is up to the parent to provide transportation to a school that can be many miles away.

-- Admission requirements. Private schools get to pick which students they wish to admit, ensuring that they have the cream of the crop. Also, Private schools do not have to admit special education students.

2. Public school students are not funded at the same level as private school students. Per pupil funding for Colorado is about $10,100. That amount includes instruction, support services, capital outlays, and debt payments.

Private school tuition at the high school level range from $15,000 - $25,000. These schools are spending 50% - 250% more per student.

Private schools also pay their teachers less money. Much of this is subsidized by the state as public school teachers often retire in their early 50s after 30 years of service and collect their pension while being paid a lower salary to teach in the private schools for about 10 -15 years.

Originally Posted by eaton place

I think the case will progress further, to be candid

It will be appealed, to be sure. I just don't think it will succeed. The voucher program violates the state constitution. The board will have to prove that the state constitution somehow violates the U.S. Constitution in order to be thrown out. Since the U.S. Constitution does not deal with public education, this is a classic 10th Amendment issue.

[GoldenZephyr]

Calix, great post, thank you for calling out another posters hatred and distortions.

This about this, people like Skydog make up lies about something so important like another persons religious beliefs, of course they would make up lies about something lesser like an election.

That is why you can't believe the stories about the board, they are spread by people who make up hateful vicious lies about anything they disagree with.

If a supporter of the opposition like Skydog is so comfortable with blatant distortions about a persons spiritual belief, you think they'd have any problem making up lies about a school board? No way!

[SkyDog77]

Originally Posted by Calix

You probably fancied yourself so clever with that hateful remark. Did it make you feel good to degrade?

Pretty easy to bully and ridicule Christians right

You might even have a clever Christian bashing bumper sticker on your car.

Of course a brave person like you wouldn't post a Mohammed cartoon or put something mocking Mohammed on your car, but that's 'cause Muslims fight back.

When you say religion, you mostly only mean one belief, Christianity. That's why that's the first place you went. Predictable as the day is long.

Relax Francis. Just making a joke about funding religious schools and using a bit of hyperbole to make a point.

I only picked Christianity because our country is 70%+ Christian. I don't want my money to be used on funding ANY religious schools. If you look at the data on where the Douglas County vouchers were being used it was almost exclusively Christian Schools.

It's only easy and predictable because it's true.

I don't put bumper stickers on my car

[davidv]

Originally Posted by eaton place

Yeah, it's pretty common now... same thing for fees related to sports, supplies, etc.

Most districts provide free transportation, often at great cost.

Some school districts on the plains have to transport their students so far, that they have implemented 4-day weeks. Kids attend school longer and get an extra day off.

[eatsDEN]

Originally Posted by davidv

This is part of the free market myth that the right has been perpetuating for years. The idea that competition is a panacea for education is misguided, at best.

1. Competition works only if all people have equal access to the service.

2. Public school students are not funded at the same level as private school students.

growing up in New Orleans, many private schools had work/study programs and scholarships that would allow lower earning families to participate in the private school systems there - is that not common elsewhere? As I mentioned - I'm not cognizant of school issues here, due to my demographic...

As to the second point, it is my understanding that expenditure doesn't equal student performance...


Funding becomes an issue when folks start framing the other folks as being supported by "big business" or "evil industry" or "teacher's unions" or "whatever" - and yet deny the same support is on their end of the spectrum... in my opinion


Also, as a side note, I find the ridiculing and disrescect shown in some folks communication with other folks to be counter-productive to civil discourse.... sure, it has become very common to demean and denigrate others in recent times -- that does not mean that it is an acceptable practice to participate in...

[Calix]

Originally Posted by SkyDog77

I only picked Christianity because our country is 70%+ Christian. I don't want my money to be used on funding ANY religious schools. If you look at the data on where the Douglas County vouchers were being used it was almost exclusively Christian Schools.

It's only easy and predictable because it's true.

I don't put bumper stickers on my car

No you picked on Christianity, like a bully. You made mocking and degrading statements, that isn't disagreement.

You could have said "you don't want money to go to religious education" and left it at that. You targeted Christianity, you singled it out for your contempt, that's bullying, that's hateful.

[eatsDEN]

Originally Posted by davidv

Most districts provide free transportation, often at great cost.

Some school districts on the plains have to transport their students so far, that they have implemented 4-day weeks. Kids attend school longer and get an extra day off.

Fair fees? Facing cuts, more schools charge for busing
this article is from late 2014...

It's always been a little unclear whether transportation is the responsibility of the district or the parent," Paul Teske, professor and Dean of the School of Public Affairs at the University of Colorado Denver, said. "While all states guarantee free education, the language used typically doesn't include transportation in a legal sense, so it's been a gray area."

Though only 12 states allowed their public school districts to charge for transportation in 2011, according to the Florida Legislature Office of Program Policy Analysis and Government Accountability, that number looks poised to grow.

[SkyDog77]

Originally Posted by Calix

No you picked on Christianity, like a bully. You made mocking and degrading statements, that isn't disagreement.

You could have said "you don't want money to go to religious education" and left it at that. You targeted Christianity, you singled it out for your contempt, that's bullying, that's hateful.

I did say I don't want my money going to religious education. Sorry that you feel bullied. Focus on the first 7 paragraphs and give me a decent rebuttal. I'll happily delete the joke if that's what is standing in your way.

I will add though that facts are facts. This agenda is being driven BY CHRISTIANS. The goal is to use money in CHRISTIAN schools. Douglas County proves that this is where the money is going. To deny that this is the case is denying facts. I'm not sorry if that makes you uncomfortable.

Now, if you please, make a convincing case that vouchers don't harm the poor and I'll step aside and even post a funny Mohammed joke next to Jesus one.

[randomparent]

Originally Posted by Gorges

Students have to pay to ride a school bus??? I've never heard of such a thing.

That is the case in Douglas County. It is not the case in Cherry Creek School District, which also provides a late bus service for middle schoolers who participate in after school activities. I am not familiar with other Denver metro area school districts.