Social Security Disability Benefits - Where Do You Stand? (unemployed, enemy, legal)
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I am all for those disabled that can not work but I am alos for them elmianting fruad in the system. Bascaillyit l;ike any other and is retty wide spread IMO.
I know several people who collect ss dis and are able to work. There is a ton of fraud out there and ss dis is becoming the new welfare.
The system is so out of hand that it has spawned a growing cottage industry of disability lawyers who specialize in getting your claim honored
and accepted by the SSA. They work on the contingency basis and charge those who're successful at being granted these plums, a percentage of the cut.
I'm sure that they have their own team of doctors who work with them in establishing the basis of the claim, slipped disc, bad knees, neck pains etc. and
only a fool would believe that there is no fraud involved within the system. Many of those who look for a hook that will give them a chance to coast through life
without having to carry their own weight, they know that the system is broken and they sneak through the cracks. Isn't that part of human nature, at least it
seems to be the policy among our leaders, another breed of those who also feed at the public trough. If man can create the system, why would there not be a
class of people ready and eager to violate that system?
In a day when a person like Bernie Madoff, can pull off a 50 billion dollar swindle, over a twenty year period, right under their pointy, governmental noses,
how much harder would it be for John Q. Public to be granted his disability status?
SS disability is very difficult to get. The criteria for it is very stiff. Many lawyers work strictly in SS disability cases. Most everyone who applies for it is refused initially. Most the furror is urban legend. Someone knows someone who lives next door to someone who gets it but can push the pickup down the street to get it started. I'm sure there is a very small percentage who draw it fraudulently but it's not like welfare, where you walk in the door with a baby in your arms and one hanging on your skirt and say you don't know where the father is and you get a check in 48 hrs.
Those of you that are young - You may see Social Security/Disabilty as an unnessesary and unfair burden.
But, wait until you are in the workforce for a few years...And you begin to see how things can go very wrong in people's lives...Even yours...And I know just how confident you are about yourself...You'll always be able to take care of yourself.
But, as time goes on, and you see cut-backs in your workplaces,and perhaps even lose a job or two yourself (for some economic reason or other)...You will start thinking about what makes it "social security"...Especially if you find youself digging into your savings and retirement funds to get by those periods that you may find yourself out of work.
Life is a long time...Many things change in your life.
Yes, there are cheats...We can solve that by simply reporting them - Can't we?...But, are your ready to report that dirtbag neighbor of yours?...It would help solve the problem.
Well!..Maybe you will think about it. In the meantime, he treats you and everyone else like a piece of crap, but you will not turn him in....So, they get away with it.
SS ends up helping many people that worked very hard in their lives. They paid taxes. But, their pension plans turned out to be worthless, or they lost their jobs and had to do menial work for years...And ended up relying only on SS.
It can happen to any one of us...Don't full yourself...All of those people were just as smart and ambitious as you and just as confident....right up to their fifties and even sixties...But, for many - things went wrong.
Mostly you have to think of the people that never had an education, but always worked hard...They could never get decent paying jobs, nor even pensions. And they spent every penny on their families...They didn't take food stamps or government help.
People call them trailer park trash...But they aren't trash at all...They are truly the laboring working class. Working at just above minimum wages. And now they've been losing their jobs to Asia, and they're doing whatever else they can do for work.
SS is important to them...And for many of them, Medicare will allow them to really see a doctor for the first itme in their lives...They couldn't afford to get sick while they were working.
With the current economic times, it should be a reminder of how important it could be in your life.
Here's a side note for those who don't really read a lot on the subject they see fit to comment on, the entire SSDI system is actually a great provider for the Attorney's that helped set it up in the first place. The reason that so many are initially denied is that they are now needing a lawyer, when you go for the final disposition by an administrative Judge you will need that lawyer that has a "special" relationship with the courts and the SS system. Judges are just lawyers who jumped sides to get the benefit of whatever their old colleagues can provide. In these cases of determination it's usually a quid pro quo, those who allow their lawyer the benefit of their SSDI money upfront are seen (by the Judge) as a better candidate than he who doesn't hire one of the good ol' boys from the Bar association. Cheating? Yes it is.
To reiterate part of my original post I'd like to point out that fraud and general corruption are part of any system that provides, provides what? Anything really, contracts, promotions, loans, food, shelter, defense, you name it and the system that provides will be subject to that aspect of human nature that seeks a better deal by going around the rules. When I was in the Army we saw tons of corrupt practices that cost the taxpayers plenty, when I was working at one of America's largest suppliers of military equipment I saw the same type of fraud there. Who benefitted from these practices?
I can't figure out if some of the posts herein are from the young who simply don't see the nature of systemic fraud or whether some folks are really gunning for the agenda of the upper class that seems to be well represented by hate radio/TV, these are the fine citizens that cry over their tax dollars going to help people they suspect are cheating "the system" when in fact it is they who are the biggest and most damaging crooks in our system. But don't look over their way, look where the the radio/TV man is telling you to look, at your neighbor. A lot of our most esteemed citizens didn't get rich by playing by the rules. No amount of cheating is right but I'd rather we really worked on the biggest cheats first...
Here's a side note for those who don't really read a lot on the subject they see fit to comment on, the entire SSDI system is actually a great provider for the Attorney's that helped set it up in the first place. The reason that so many are initially denied is that they are now needing a lawyer, when you go for the final disposition by an administrative Judge you will need that lawyer that has a "special" relationship with the courts and the SS system. Judges are just lawyers who jumped sides to get the benefit of whatever their old colleagues can provide. In these cases of determination it's usually a quid pro quo, those who allow their lawyer the benefit of their SSDI money upfront are seen (by the Judge) as a better candidate than he who doesn't hire one of the good ol' boys from the Bar association. Cheating? Yes it is.
To reiterate part of my original post I'd like to point out that fraud and general corruption are part of any system that provides, provides what? Anything really, contracts, promotions, loans, food, shelter, defense, you name it and the system that provides will be subject to that aspect of human nature that seeks a better deal by going around the rules. When I was in the Army we saw tons of corrupt practices that cost the taxpayers plenty, when I was working at one of America's largest suppliers of military equipment I saw the same type of fraud there. Who benefitted from these practices?
I can't figure out if some of the posts herein are from the young who simply don't see the nature of systemic fraud or whether some folks are really gunning for the agenda of the upper class that seems to be well represented by hate radio/TV, these are the fine citizens that cry over their tax dollars going to help people they suspect are cheating "the system" when in fact it is they who are the biggest and most damaging crooks in our system. But don't look over their way, look where the the radio/TV man is telling you to look, at your neighbor. A lot of our most esteemed citizens didn't get rich by playing by the rules. No amount of cheating is right but I'd rather we really worked on the biggest cheats first...
I'm not sure who exactly you are railing against. Are you saying the whole disability system is mostly fraud and recieved by people who don't deserve it? Are you saying that all the lawyers who represent claiments are in bed with the judges and they are gaming the system by acting as gatekeepers to benefits? Are you saying that SSI disability recipients are all frauds? Are people who defend the SSI system all traitors to the american people? All?, Most?, Some? Few?. If your post is all your opinion or speculation I can still respect it but let's label it as such. Otherwise we would need some verifiable stats to base a real debate on the issue.
I have qualms about the criteria being used to define disability, and eligibility for disability benefits. I believe that while many with mental illnesses cannot engage in gainful employment, there are many who have family members that are earning a full wage and are able to support the disabled person living with them. Sometimes people have amassed substantial wealth before qualifying for disability benefits. In these cases these payments are not warranted until the financial status of these families have deteriorated to a "need-based" level. SS should not be used to maintain a higher standard of living.
There are people with mental or physical "disabilities" who are able to perform temporary work, although not in their preferred field. I believe that this should not qualify as permanent disabilities - only temporary, as needed.
Social security benefits and Medicare are also given to well-off people who subsequently retire. I do not agree with this either. Probably the best thing to do is to phase out the system and have people save for their own eventuality.
While governments need to provide basic needs for disabled/elderly people who can't take care of themselves, it is probably best to do so in a very structured, low-cost, highly efficient manner.... rather than disbursing random checks to random people each month, with the money subsequently being spent on random things. I am sure some people are capable of budgeting wisely, but I also believe that many of them can't. A lot of fraud occurs too. There needs to be some accountability here.
The SS system is a progressive system that essentially takes away from the well -off to provide for the middle class and poor. It is a fact that the wealthy get a far less percentage back relative to the taxes that they paid in during their working lives. The poorer ppl can collect what they put in plus SSI payments if they qualify. when SS was created, it was sold to the American public as a program which would benefit EVERYONE.
I find it disturbing that those who plan well, work and earn a lot would be "punished" for doing so by receiving lesser SS entitlements.
I also beleive that immigrants should be barred from receiving anything beyond what they put into the system. Too many of them are collecting far beyond what they put in by qualifying for all the gravy train entitlements like medicaid, SSI and medicare.
There's a lot of passing judgement in this thread.
Here's my brother's story. Last March, at the age of 61, he began receiving social security disability. Beginning in his early teens, he began having severe knee problems. There were three surgeries on one knee, and one surgery on the other knee. One doctor told our mom to make sure he went to college as he would never be able to do manual labor. My brother was also a talented musician. He had perfect pitch, and could play anything by ear. In 1968, when Viet Nam was hot and heavy, the marines were recruiting him for the Marines Band. He wanted in badly, but got an F4 on the physical, to his chagrin.
He learned the carpentry profession by working with my dad, and worked as a carpenter his entire life. He also did a lot of cement finishing when he was younger. Construction isn't an 8 to 5 job with benefits, in most cases. Though his knees never held up for him he worked through the pain and tried to make it to retirement age. However, in the last two years he had managed to work almost none at all. He lived off of almost nothing during that period. He is in a motorcycle club, so his MC brothers helped him when and where they could. Finally, in early 10' he got a steady carpentry job. He loved the job, but two weeks into it one of his knees went out on him. He kept working as he didn't want to lose the job. The next day the other knee disintegrated. He was incapacitated, and didn't know what to do. This is a man who has never in his life received any government assistance. Ever.
Our tribe helped him get the process started to apply for SSD. All of us told him to not get frustrated as almost no one gets it on the first try. When he went to the doctor that was assigned to him for the disability physical, that doctor also looked at the carpel tunnel in his right hand and the arthritis in his shoulder. My brother received full disability with the first attempt. SSD isn't just handed out. My brother never had to hire an attorney to receive SSD.
In 2006, when my brother was in his late 50's he needed a job. He took a framing job, and was working in triple digit heat with guys in their 20's who were crawling off to the shade and throwing up from heat exhaustion. My 6'4" brother toughed it out for a long time.
Two months ago a doctor tested him for the carpel tunnel and said it was the worst case he had seen in a very, very long time.
I hated seeing him the last couple of years in so much pain and nearly incapacitated. He knew only one trade: carpentry and cement finishing. Working cement was out of the question with his knees and his age.
All I know is my brother is one tough son of a gun. We're not suppose to call names on here, so I will refrain, but I'll leave you with this----when you are in your late 50's and can work all day in triple digit heat with twenty somethings then you can complain. When you can work your entire adult life in a skilled trade profession that is NOT in an air conditioned office then you can complain. Otherwise, just know that I believe whiners are little wimps. SSD is for people like my brother. People who can no longer work.
A nation that will not care for those who cannot work or care for themselves is not much of a nation.
They work on the contingency basis and charge those who're successful at being granted these plums, a percentage of the cut.
No they don't.
The lawyers are allowed only 25% of the lump sum payment by law, not the 1/3 contingency.
I was denied for my claim, but because the nurse practitioner had no experience with my claim and never even bothered to read the file, I appealed and was granted the appeal 30 days later.
The law firm of Mooney & Park prepared the appeal and stated in their letter that because they worked on it less than 30 days, they did not believe they deserved the full 25% and instead took a lesser amount of only $1,300.
I have since been granted VA Disability benefits so no longer receive SSDI.
The issue here is not whether there should or shouldn't be SSDI, but whether we should accept and tolerate fraudulent claims.
Any fraud, even a single case of fraud harms the system.
Up through 1986, SSDI was instantly granted to alcoholics and drug abusers who lived on the streets and had their SSDI checks sent to a homeless shelter and they typically blew the money in less than a week on alcohol, drugs and prostitutes.
A 60 Minutes segment caused an uproar and when the Republicans closed that loop-hole in the law in 1984.
However, the alcoholics and drug abusers now simply claim they're "depressed" and the still get benefits.
I'm currently living round the corner from Tender Mercies, essentially a "homeless" shelter for the "mentally ill" and many of those people receive or are waiting to receive SSDI. A very small percentage are truly unable to hold a job, like the "Walker" who walks around the block (literally) for 8-12 hours at a time mumbling to himself, and the "Pole-man" who has intense discussions with parking meters, light poles, telephone poles and such, but the majority are just alcoholics and drug abusers who sit in the alley drinking beer behind my apartment, or sit in Washington Park with other street people drinking beer or using drugs or spending the day in a bar.
There are about a half-dozen grown men whose job it is to play World of Warcraft all day at taxpayer expense.
Nearly all of the receive food stamps and engage in food stamp fraud as well (you can't walk by the front of the buildings -- there are three -- without someone offering their food stamps for sale -- the going rate is apparent $1 cash for $2 food stamps).
As a private investigator I investigated worker's compensation fraud (about 3 in 10 are fraudulent) and burned quite a few people, including a chiropractor who was triple billing the state (he had three offices and billed claims from all three offices and many of the appointments were false -- no one showed up at any of the three offices but the state was still billed).
A woman in Hillsboro, Ohio was drawing worker's comp benefits but had her own business in Metamora, Indiana. She lost her home and got 3-5 years (I think at Marysville where they have/had a correctional facility for women).
The government does not investigate SSDI/SSI fraud, but it needs to.
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We should work to improve it...all of us
