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I haven't noticed much snobby activity in Madison, although it's likely one of the wealthy cities in the 'Sip, in many other states it'd be average. People in MS are polite, but may not go out of the their way to include new comers into social circles. It really depends on how out going you are and how much effort you put into making friends. A lot of social connections are made through church and sports.
I wouldn't worry too much about yazoo clay. Over 28 years, I've had 6 houses in Madison and Rankin Counties and no foundation issues in any. Foundation issues are usually the result of the builder going cheap when preparing the pad on spec houses.
If you custom build make sure to use a reputable contractor who understands slab foundations and you'll be fine. If you buy an established home, you and your inspector will be able to sus out any foundation issues (additionally any issues should be in the disclosure). Assuming a brick exterior (which is common) walk around and look for cracks in the brick, a few hairline cracks on an older house is fine also, you should be able see any major repairs. An older home with freshly painted brick may be a indication of the homeowner trying to hide repairs of cracks. Streets in very bad shape in a neighborhood CAN (but not always) be an indicator of a lot of yazoo clay in the area was well as driveways in poor shape.
I think Township or Waterpointe would be a good fit for your needs, a walkalbe neighborhood next door to shopping and dining. If being able to walk to shopping or dining is not important to you, you may want to consider Tradition or Lost Rabbit (there is a 10 plus minute car ride from either of these to shopping or dining). There are many other communities in MS that may fit your needs so take your time to check them all out.
Again, before buying or building on the coast, double, triple, quadruple check the cost of insurance and floodplain information.
The Coast towns and Jackson suburbs aren't really comparable, because the towns on the Coast are genuine stand-alone towns that are all next to each other. They don't feel like suburbs.
Ocean Springs has a gorgeous historic district and community beach front. Outside of that, it is mostly middle-income subdivisions along a suburban highway which looks nice, but not fancy.
Bay St Louis is perhaps even more beautiful in terms of its position overlooking the bay and bay bridge, as well as having a pretty beach front. The interior part of town away from the waterfront is quite diverse and quite modest. The zip codes for Bay St Louis/Waveland, Pass Christian, Long Beach and Ocean Springs all have virtually identical per capita incomes. Diamondhead, which is strictly a suburban development that eventually became a town, is slightly higher.
The Madison and Ridgeland area in contrast is a true suburban area. The zip code for that area, 39110, has a per capita income of about $56,000. If you count the adjacent wealthy neighborhoods in western Ridgeland, it's probably closer to $60,000. Ocean Springs (39564) and the other coastal zip codes are about $33,000 per capita income, i.e. almost half that of Madison. So it's kind of apples and oranges comparing Coastal towns (each unique) to clean, affluent, planned Jackson suburbs.
It comes down to a choice between a diverse, authentic coastal lifestyle on the Coast versus a clean-cut, affluent suburban lifestyle in the Jackson area.
^ I've really enjoyed reading your posts about various MS towns. I'm definitely expecting the coast and the Jackson suburbs to be very different, but I'm not sure which I'll end up preferring.
Before seeing any of these places in person, I feel there's a 60% chance we'll find the coast to be a better fit for us and a 40% chance for the Jackson suburbs. Same with the two main MS coastal towns we're considering - I think 60% chance we'll prefer Ocean Springs and 40% chance it'll be BSL. Maybe we'll be surprised and end up picking Natchez or Pass Christian or Laurel or Hernando or Brookhaven or somewhere else that isn't a frontrunner going in but just feels right when we visit.
It's altogether possible we'll like the coast and the Jackson suburbs equally but for different reasons, and in that case it'll come down to where the right home comes up for sale. Madison area has the edge there based on what I see in the MLS. Very easy for me to find homes I like in the Madison area, I think moreso than any other location we're considering across MS, AL, and FL (in most parts of Florida it's near impossible to find a home that appeals to me.) We fully expect buying will be a challenging experience with low inventory and a lot of competition. Might take a few tries but hopefully we end up with a home we love.
We're going to explore more places than the following, but at this stage I think the top contenders are:
Ocean Springs and Bay St Louis, MS
Madison/Ridgeland area MS
Fairhope/Daphne, AL
Haile Plantation in FL
Northeast Tallahassee FL
Be sure and check out Canebrake and Lake Serene in Hattiesburg. Canebrake has beautiful homes on the same level as Madison and they've done a great job with using authentic architecture. Lake Serene Homes are more 1960s-1970s style homes on gorgeous wooded, lakeside lots. Also South 40th Avenue area (e.g. Carrie Rd, Longwood Dr). Hattiesburg's lush woodlands really make the area.
In Laurel, 5th and 6th Avenues are very beautiful. Also pretty are 13th Street and Homewood Drive (is this Atlanta or Laurel?), and Northgate Street (pretty mid-century type homes with gorgeous yards etc). Just wandering around that general area is also so pretty.
With Pass Christian, I assume you know that Pass Christian is several miles of historic homes and mansions overlooking the waterfront. And on the bayside that have new homes up on stilts overlooking the bay. They also have a new area called The Oaks Golf Club and an area a homes on big lots across from there (Stablewood Drive). All very beautiful.
Waveland is basically a continuation of Bay St Louis as you follow the beach road from downtown Bay St Louis along the beach over to Waveland. Most of those houses are new (after Katrina) and really pretty perched up on stilts with their own secluded, pretty little beach front.
In Metro Jackson, the homes for sale will direct you where to look in the Madison area, but some of the big developments to look for are Bridgewater, Reunion, Annandale, Lake Caroline, and Lost Rabbit. (There are many others). The area around the Jackson Yacht Club is very beautiful. Across the Reservoir, in an area called the Northshore, they have the Palisades and Arbor View both of which are directly on the water.
In DeSoto County, to me what stands out is how many people build homes are multi-acre lots. I guess because the better areas with good schools cover such a huge area, the supply and demand ratio allows for some big, generous lot sizes (often 2 to 10 acres) throughout the county rather than subdivisions.
In Ocean Springs, Washington Avenue is the heart of the historic district, running from downtown to the beachfront, which has cute little walking paths etc. Front Beach Drive is pretty. Also East Beach Drive is separate and takes some fenagling to get to (just use a phone app for directions etc) but has some pretty homes, many of them new since Katrina.
In Gulfport, the prettiest newer neighborhoods are Bernard Bayou on streets like Bayou Oaks Lane and Waterside Drive. Natchez has a plethora of historic homes just off downtown but also Beau Pre Country Club, as well as some pretty backroads just off the main highway where the homes are set in lush hardwood forest on ridges backing up to steep drop-offs and ravines.
Be sure and check out Canebrake and Lake Serene in Hattiesburg.
We will definitely be checking out Hattiesburg, thank you for the neighborhood recommendations! Is Hattiesburg considered a "college town" in the sense that it revolves around the university and is dominated by students? I looked up the numbers and according to my search the total population of Hattiesburg is around 47,000 and there are about 20,000 college students. Yikes! The average age in Hattiesburg is 29. My husband and I are in our early 40s but strongly prefer to be around people older than us. We have nothing against children at all, just generally don't enjoy being around "young adults."
I know that even in college towns there can be neighborhoods / areas where students don't live or hang out. Those would be the locations of interest to us. But we do want a downtown-ish area close by so if that is overrun with college kids we probably won't like it.
I wouldn't say Hattiesburg is overrun by college students. USM's Hattiesburg campus has about 11,000 students. Hattiesburg metro area is about 150,000 people. I'd say it's more accurate to say that Hattiesburg benefits from the university from a cultural perspective, because USM has the state's main art programs (e.g. music, dance, theatre), which means Hattiesburg has more than its share of those types of performances.
To me Hattiesburg feels like a small version of a modern metro area with plenty of interstates and highways with new-looking commercial developments (e.g. primarily Hwy 98 West) and lots of newish, upscale-looking residential subdivisions on the outskirts (such as Canebrake).
Also, the area is slightly rolling and covered with thick pine forests. Hattiesburg's downtown is small but actually does have some charm and genuine vibrancy to it. The central location between Jackson, Mobile, Miss Gulf Coast, and New Orleans is also a major plus.
Also, the area is slightly rolling and covered with thick pine forests.
^ That sounds especially lovely. I'm interested to see how the topography and trees differ in the various parts of the state. Obviously the gulf coast region is low lying and flat, but I know there are some hilly areas too in MS. I do like gently rolling land and I love pines.
The hardwood tree areas are along the west side of Mississippi, in Natchez, Vicksburg, Yazoo City, the Delta, Grenada, as well as in the northeastern Black Prairie area which includes Starkville, Columbus, Tupelo, and Corinth.
Apparently the rich sediment flowing down the Mississippi River over eons would get deposited through floods beside the river and then blown by the wind eastward. Consequently, the richness of the topsoil is highest near the Mississippi River and transitions slowly from hardwoods to pines as you go eastward. The Delta itself was originally a giant hardwood forest and today is mostly agriculture but with some large areas of forest and wildlife sanctuaries.
The hill counties that form the eastern border of the Delta are hardwoods. Within 30 miles east of the Delta the land begins to change from hardwoods to pines (actually to mixed forests of both pines and hardwoods), in basically the center of the state. Then on the eastern side the land changes to prairie soil and hardwoods return.
Jackson sits on the line, with Hinds and Madison Counties being primarily hardwoods and Rankin County mostly pines (with exceptions in the north of the county).
The exception is South Mississippi, which is nearly all pine forest (or mostly pines with some hardwoods mixed in). This includes Hattiesburg, Laurel, McComb, Brookhaven, and up to Brandon, Meridian, and Philadelphia.
There is also sort of an invisible line where you find the most live oak trees, especially planted in towns. The live oaks are visible in Natchez, Brookhaven, and Laurel, which all sit at about the same latitude from west to east. The towns south of that line also feature live oaks such as McComb, Hattiesburg, and Gulf Coast cities such as Ocean Springs and Long Beach.
The state highway department planted pine trees along most of the interstates throughout Mississippi, which gives the impression that the entire state is pine forests, but that's not correct. Also, many people plant pines as an economic investment, which is not always consistent with the areas's natural environment.
The only city in Ms that has a nice, active downtown is Oxford, and it has a big college too. We went there thinking of retiring (I'm originally from Gulfport), but the college would dominate the city during football season. I lived in Meridian for a spell growing up, it is definitely not what the op is looking for.
Ocean Springs might work, but it's a work in progress. When my family lived w/ an aunt and uncle while our home was being built in Gulfport, it was a sleepy small city w/ a bit of an artsy feel. That has changed quite a bit, and now they seem to want to make it into a place that competes w/ the beach towns in Florida. There are a LOT more bars and restaurants, parking can be a problem, and there is more crime than in the past.
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