New to Billings (Missoula, Great Falls, Bozeman: for sale, hair salon, renting)

[V22]

Hi All,
I've just moved to Billings from the Deep South and looking for any info that long time locals might deem helpful. A few things in particular are cars, churches and hair salons. The only vehicle I've ever owned is a '99 Dodge Ram 2500, but I'm looking to downsize, preferably to an electric sedan of some sort, for efficiency and convenience. As I'm sure many of you know, southerns don't handle snow (and especially ice) well. Any input on how well electric sedans handle snow drifts, ice, etc would be helpful. As far as churches go, I'm protestant, coming from a background in Nazarene/Assemblies of God sphere. They're more traditional denominations, but not to the point that women still wear dresses, no make up, jewelry, etc. I'm 30, but still not really into the newer churches that have all their own coffee shops and rock bands and stuff like that. However, I know a lot of the more traditional churches are down to 10 people on a good day, so I'm flexible. As far as hair salons go, I need somewhere to have my hair cut and dyed. Someone mentioned a place to me today that favors natural hair care products that don't damage your hair, which I love, but I don't remember the name of it! Anybody know what place this is, or have other recommendations? I'm on the far west end of town and haven't bought a car yet, so places close to the Scheels/Kohls/AMC Shiloh 14 would be great. Any help is greatly appreciated!

[WyoNewk]

I'd advise that you really examine the issues with an electric in Montana, or most anywhere in the Mountain West. They have a couple issues: 1. Range on a charge. They just don't go far, especially if you're considering a used one (earlier technology). Due to the wide open spaces between localities, etc., people in the Mountain West typically drive long distances when they leave town. You'll be greatly slowed by the lack of and speed of charging stations. 2: Ground clearance. Most electrics are built to slip effortlessly through the air, and that normally means building them close to the ground. That becomes a problem when the snow falls, ruts deepen and the piles of snow grow higher and higher.

If you want electric, I'd suggest a hybrid. They make their own electricity while coasting and braking so you don't have to search out charging stations. Fill it up with gas and go. I have a Prius and get 40-50 mpg. It may not be as inexpensive to operate as an electric is, but it's as simple as your Ram -- fill with fuel and go.

I still have a bit of a problem with the minimal ground clearance, especially in the winter, but if I plan ahead and keep good dedicated snow tires on it, I get around fairly well. My ground clearance, iirc, is 5.5 inches. It's limiting. I drive 25-30K miles per year and needed something cheaper to operate than my old F250 diesel. It's probably a quarter the cost to operate, but I can't go places that I could in the 4x4.

Unless you really need your fuel mileage to be way up there, something like a RAV4 hybrid might be the best of both worlds -- a little extra ground clearance but still very good fuel economy.

Can't help you with hair salons. I polish my noggin now and then and am good to go.

[V22]

Thanks! If I buy an electric car it will definitely be new, Tesla is what I've been looking at, but now I will look into the RAV4. I'm just trying to get away from the constant need for maintenance with gasoline cars. Especially with the pot holes and snow ruts up here. Pot holes alone in the south can throw your transmission or bust tires, and up here so far they actually look worse. And believe me I've considered the same hair option but now that it's 50 degrees lower than what I'm used to, that aint happening, lol!

[NW Crow]

Good winter tires is indeed important as just stated. But only half the battle. Associate has run Prius with and without winter tires. With, passable in mountains. Without, not good and he pulls out the SUV. Maybe better tires again next winter.


If you will be sticking to main city roads, probably good enough. Can change to something else if it doesn't work out.


Which salon? I dunno. But probably on this list http://www.google.com/search?q=billi...HVwEAb0QjGoINw

[mtriverviking]

For Billings I suggest something disposable with locks, alarm and generally undesirable for theft.

[ericsvibe]

In Montana, a Tesla is a toy. Think of it along the same lines as a Corvette, Mustang, Camaro. When the weather is good, it's fine. As soon as the weather turns bad, it's useless. Teslas have very large tires and they aren't cheap. Even electric vehicles have to be maintained, and in extreme cold environments, the batteries take a beating. There are ton's of used hybrids for sale on craiglists, most of them have battery issues. That is the way it works, as soon as the car hits around 100k, the batteries start going bad and they try to dump the car on another person, because dealerships have gotten smart about it and won't give them anything on trade in.


I would purchase an old 4x4 until you learn how to drive in the winter. My wife totaled out our Expedition 2 weeks into the first big winter storm we had, after moving to Montana from Florida. We had just paid it off. She hit the back of a parked truck when she tried to negotiate a corner, and the front tires lost traction and she continued in a straight line. That big truck she hit didn't budge. Because all of the airbags deployed, it was written off.


You haven't found out yet, but in Montana, the state figures that if you have the money to purchase a new vehicle, you can pay over $600.00 a year to register it. A new Tesla will probably run about $1,000.00 to register. The state charges a "property tax" based on the value of a vehicle. New vehicles will make your eyes water.

[Reziac]

If I really wanted to downsize, I'd look at an all-wheel-drive Subaru or something similar. Also do your test-driving on the most snowed-over, icy, rutted, unplowed streets you can find... cuz otherwise you're going to get a nasty surprise first time we get a serious snow and the plows can't get to all the streets before the snow gets packed and starts icing up. Not the best time to discover how you and the car get along under bad road conditions.

The only person I've spoken to with a hybrid said it was worthless in real snow due to lack of torque -- any little obstacle and it was stuck. Couldn't wait to be rid of it.

I suppose if you can afford a new Tesla, your electric bill won't be much of a shock.

[Tchotchkes]

Erm, electric cars have _significantly_ more torque than internal combustion engines; a Chevy spark EV has 327 lb/ft of torque, and that’s all available instantly. Likewise, hybrid vehicles tend to have a disproportionate amount of torque available in the low RPM range due to the electric motor. As far as how they fair in Montana; the lack of charging stations and low population density would make long distance travel challenging. This, however, can be bypassed by simply renting a car whenever you want to travel to the sticks. You would have minimal issues in town with a Tesla, in particular one equipped with AWD, due to the locking differential. Battery’s would be a non issue so long as you have a warranty, and Tesla’s warranty’s are absurdly robust. If you don’t keep the car clean and prevent ice buildup on the brakes you could lose some range as that’d hamper the regenerative braking.... but that’s a minor issue.

As far as Salons go, Fringe at 32nd & Central is quality.

[mtriverviking]

Coming from personal experience if you are going to live in Billings either have a much older vehicle that is generally undesirable for theft or have a full blown gps tracking/ignition disabler system. Theft is an issue, always have been and only has gotten worse.

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by mtriverviking

Coming from personal experience if you are going to live in Billings either have a much older vehicle that is generally undesirable for theft or have a full blown gps tracking/ignition disabler system. Theft is an issue, always have been and only has gotten worse.

Compared to where?

per capita:
https://www.cars.com/articles/which-...1420683405005/

raw stats:
Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not ok
FBI major crime stats by city (scroll down to Billings)
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s...abledatadecpdf
(Great Falls and Missoula are also in this chart, but not Bozeman or Butte)

Auto theft per capita in 2012, for nearest major metros compared to Billings, plus a few for shock value

78 - Idaho average exclusive of Lewiston and CDL
131 - MIssoula
151 - Lewiston, ID
153 - Cheyenne WY
171 - Casper WY
190 - Great Falls
192 - CDL, ID
196 - Rapid City, SD
304 - Billings
393 - Salt Lake City
562 - Spokane
3,556 - Seattle
3,585 - Portland, OR
3,670 - Denver
8,190 - NYC
15,084 - Los Angeles
17,001 - Chicago

So Billings is high for Montana, but paltry compared to larger cities.