Why is Philly's freeway system inferior compared to Boston, NYC and Washington (Philadelphia: how much, employment)

[usernameunavailable]

Doing a research project, and wanted opinions from locals. Why does the design of the freeways in Philly seem so bad compared to other NEC cities, and why does the traffic seem so bad relative to the population?

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by usernameunavailable

Doing a research project, and wanted opinions from locals. Why does the design of the freeways in Philly seem so bad compared to other NEC cities, and why does the traffic seem so bad relative to the population?

The Schuylkill Expressway was built before the Interstate Highway System even existed, and rich NIMBYs prevented the proper capacity from being built on the southernmost six miles of the "Blue Route." Those two things alone account for almost all the ****tiness in Philadelphia's highway system, and they both need to be directly corrected at some point. As for I-95, it's being reconstructed and widened for its entire length in Pennsylvania, so it's about to graduate from adequate to very modern, just like the Northeast Extension of the Pennsylvania Turnpike, and U.S. 202 in the western suburbs.

[Janszoon]

Originally Posted by usernameunavailable

Doing a research project, and wanted opinions from locals. Why does the design of the freeways in Philly seem so bad compared to other NEC cities, and why does the traffic seem so bad relative to the population?

It doesn't. I've lived in both Boston and Philly and Boston's freeways are much worse than Philly's. I'd also say traffic in general is much worse in Boston, NYC and DC than it is in Philly.

[chicagoliz]

Philly traffic is much worse than other cities with horrendous traffic. I live in a city that's 30-35 miles outside the city, and it takes 2 hours to commute to the city. This makes it damn near impossible for many people to take a job in the city, and long term, it is going to economically hurt the area.

The main E-W expressway is TWO lanes at one point. TWO LANES! That should never have been allowed. Ever. This causes unimaginable backups, particularly in the morning. And out where I am there is NO commuter rail -- you have to drive a half hour to even get to a train, and the transit system is by far the worst I've ever encountered in a major city. It is appallingly awful.

So, when you have no mass transit, and a two-lane expressway, you get horrible traffic.

From where I live, it should not regularly take 2 hours to commute into the city. My husband accepted a job in Boston, and he said he'd rather move there than take another job in Philadelphia. So we're moving. I know traffic is awful in Boston, too, but anywhere we go, the commute will be better than what we have now.

[Duderino]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

It doesn't. I've lived in both Boston and Philly and Boston's freeways are much worse than Philly's. I'd also say traffic in general is much worse in Boston, NYC and DC than it is in Philly.

Definitely. In fact, according to a recent report, Philly ranks only 22nd in traffic delays, which is FAR below where its population rank would indicate: D.C. Has Worst Traffic in U.S., Study Says | NBC4 Washington

DC, NY and Boston are all in the top 6. While the Schuylkill Expressway and parts of I-95 understandably have a well-deserved awful reputation, the rest of the metro area honestly does not come close into comparison to the obscene congestion in other large cities.

If anything, the freeways in the rest of the Northeast Corridor cities are much more inferior based on population/congestion ratio.

[Duderino]

Originally Posted by chicagoliz

The main E-W expressway is TWO lanes at one point. TWO LANES! That should never have been allowed. Ever. This causes unimaginable backups, particularly in the morning. And out where I am there is NO commuter rail -- you have to drive a half hour to even get to a train, and the transit system is by far the worst I've ever encountered in a major city. It is appallingly awful.

So, when you have no mass transit, and a two-lane expressway, you get horrible traffic.

From where I live, it should not regularly take 2 hours to commute into the city. My husband accepted a job in Boston, and he said he'd rather move there than take another job in Philadelphia. So we're moving. I know traffic is awful in Boston, too, but anywhere we go, the commute will be better than what we have now.

You're in for a rude awakening in Boston, then. The traffic in/out of the city is abysmal, and public transit in Boston is only very marginally better than Philly, and even that's debatable. My wife currently commutes from a 'burb that's about 20 miles out from the city and her RT commute can take upward of 3 hours each day. That's pretty absurd for being relatively close to the city.

Don't let "grass is greener" syndrome cloud objective judgement. Commuting in any large metro area is FAR from a cakewalk, and it is only getting worse.

[chicagoliz]

I've lived in Boston before. I know traffic in any large metro area is awful. Philadelphia's is the worst I've experienced, and I've lived in Chicago, Boston, DC, and seen traffic in LA and Atlanta.

Public transportation goes further out in Boston than it does in Philly.

[BPP1999]

Originally Posted by chicagoliz

And out where I am there is NO commuter rail -- you have to drive a half hour to even get to a train, and the transit system is by far the worst I've ever encountered in a major city. It is appallingly awful.

So, when you have no mass transit, and a two-lane expressway, you get horrible traffic.

From where I live, it should not regularly take 2 hours to commute into the city. My husband accepted a job in Boston, and he said he'd rather move there than take another job in Philadelphia. So we're moving. I know traffic is awful in Boston, too, but anywhere we go, the commute will be better than what we have now.

Seems a bit exaggerated if you ask me.

I live about 30 miles from the city, and if I drive to the train station (1/2 hr), I have a 45 minute commute from there, for about 1.25 hrs door-to-door.

I guess it all depends on perception, though. I had an old boss originally from Chicago who moved to Bryn Mawr PA about 20 years ago. His take on the situation was to brag about how much closer he could live to Philadelphia vs. Chicago and still take the same amount of time commuting. Usually people from other regions brag about how much worse traffic is there vs. here.

As for SEPTA, our transit system is one of the top 5 in the US, without question, and SEPTA's regional rail system is regarded as quick and fairly reliable. Not only that but there are regions of Montgomery, Bucks, and Chester Counties that have tremendous access to the city via rail (i.e. multiple stops on multiple lines within 1-2 miles). Perhaps you moved here without doing your research.

To your point, though, SEPTA's regional rail system is perhaps more truncated than any other system in the county. The Norristown line used to go to Pottsville, the Lansdale line used to go to Allentown, the Fox Chase line used to go to Newtown, and the Elwyn line used to go to West Chester). Since you live here, you can call your US and state reps and demand that they support funding to restore train service.

[Duderino]

Originally Posted by chicagoliz

I've lived in Boston before. I know traffic in any large metro area is awful. Philadelphia's is the worst I've experienced, and I've lived in Chicago, Boston, DC, and seen traffic in LA and Atlanta.

Public transportation goes further out in Boston than it does in Philly.

I think depending on employment vs. living location, it can definitely be tricky to commute in the Philly area.

Also, I'd argue that public transit can actually go relatively far out in the Philly area, but it depends on where. For example in the Montgomery County/422 commuter corridor, SEPTA is definitely lacking, but commuter rail goes much farther into the suburbs in other directions (e.g., Trenton and Doylestown directly north of the city, Thorndale in Western Chester County, and Wilmington south of the city).

In that sense, it can be hit-or-miss, but like Boston, it's spottier the farther out you go from the city.

[pman]

Originally Posted by chicagoliz

I've lived in Boston before. I know traffic in any large metro area is awful. Philadelphia's is the worst I've experienced, and I've lived in Chicago, Boston, DC, and seen traffic in LA and Atlanta.

Public transportation goes further out in Boston than it does in Philly.

I find it hard to believe you have lived in those places and came to those conclusions. DC is awful and the commuter rail system in DC is atrocious. If you don't live near the metro you are screwed and the metro is having serious problems right now. every single area you mentioned was ranked as worse than Philadelphia and DC is certainly worse.