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It's a waste of taxpayer money, plain and simple. And I'd guess those who think our public education system is so bad because we don't spend enough money on it, I'd think those who believe in that direction would agree that's far more important to spend tax payer dollars on and that should be by far our first priority with tax payer funds, not on building stadiums for private business, ie corporate welfare.
You are right. It is a waste of tax payer money in terms of return on investment but some things are worth paying taxes for in my opinion because they do provide entertainment and a sense of pride for the community. I would be willing to pay taxes for a quality organization that will invest in the team and truly believes in winning. I don't get that feeling with the Coyotes. I feel like they are trying to pull one over on the Valley. They want another awesome stadium, they want the taxpayers to pay for it and they want to be cheap and not spend money on players. I don't know if their ownership will ever spend the money to compete for a Stanley Cup. And if they are not doing that, no one will watch them. This isn't Canada where there is nothing to do aside from watching hockey and people will foolishly support the team no matter what.
For once, I wish the Valley got an owner like Mark Cuban who has money and wants to win a championship. If we got an owner like that, the Valley would sell out those stadiums. When we Colangelo, the Suns sold out every year. Since Sarver has taken over, the team can't sell tickets; he is another cheap owner who doesn't care about winning.
Going back to this, it is interesting to read the feedback. I don't get the impression that anyone is going to support taxpayer money going toward their stadium. I have a feeling the Coyotes will be going back to the drawing board.
You are right. It is a waste of tax payer money in terms of return on investment but some things are worth paying taxes for in my opinion because they do provide entertainment and a sense of pride for the community. I would be willing to pay taxes for a quality organization that will invest in the team and truly believes in winning. I don't get that feeling with the Coyotes. I feel like they are trying to pull one over on the Valley. They want another awesome stadium, they want the taxpayers to pay for it and they want to be cheap and not spend money on players. I don't know if their ownership will ever spend the money to compete for a Stanley Cup. And if they are not doing that, no one will watch them. This isn't Canada where there is nothing to do aside from watching hockey and people will foolishly support the team no matter what.
For once, I wish the Valley got an owner like Mark Cuban who has money and wants to win a championship. If we got an owner like that, the Valley would sell out those stadiums. When we Colangelo, the Suns sold out every year. Since Sarver has taken over, the team can't sell tickets; he is another cheap owner who doesn't care about winning.
Going back to this, it is interesting to read the feedback. I don't get the impression that anyone is going to support taxpayer money going toward their stadium. I have a feeling the Coyotes will be going back to the drawing board.
I think with some renewed interest in the Coyotes they'd be willing to pony up some cash to put a better product in the arena. The issue is that we have a horrible location in a city that held a public meeting to evict them from their arena.
Put them in Tempe, maybe give some incentives to get season tickets coupled with the Sun Devils and they might be able to rekindle themselves a bit.
But its like when the Cardinals were at SDS, why even both investing in the team? Once the Cardinals got UOPS the product improved dramatically. I think the Coyotes have similar potential.
I don't get the impression that anyone is going to support taxpayer money going toward their stadium. I have a feeling the Coyotes will be going back to the drawing board.
Or to the Reservation!
I feel this was there favored option/location, with the Reservation being their backup plan, if they can't find the funding for the Tempe arena by next June.
I think with some renewed interest in the Coyotes they'd be willing to pony up some cash to put a better product in the arena. The issue is that we have a horrible location in a city that held a public meeting to evict them from their arena.
Put them in Tempe, maybe give some incentives to get season tickets coupled with the Sun Devils and they might be able to rekindle themselves a bit.
But its like when the Cardinals were at SDS, why even both investing in the team? Once the Cardinals got UOPS the product improved dramatically. I think the Coyotes have similar potential.
I agree that the location has some doing with their attendance but in all actuality the team really stinks. There never seems to be any energy at the games and if there is it's from opposing fans. We were just there Saturday night against the B's and I've never been to a more boring, dull game.
I've seen games from Montreal - Miami and this team is down right boring to watch. Granted this isn't Canada but even the Florida Panthers have exciting games and their fans are crazy (back when they'd throw fake rats on the ice). I've seen many games here and just never felt any energy from the fans or the team like in other arenas. I'd like to see them stay as it's nice to have a home town team but honestly I don't ever see them being a top contender unless like mentioned before you get an owner with deep pockets willing to shell out big money for big name players.
Correct me if I'm wrong but when the Cards moved to UOP Michael Bidwill took over the team as president. Almost the same scenario as the Blackhawks were in when the older Wirtz owned the team and never spent the money needed to make the team competitive. Like Michael once Rocky took over from his dad and started spending money on players the team started to take off (3 cups in 6 years). I don't see the Yotes doing any of this with their current owners. A nice new arena won't win you championships especially when your players are mediocre at best. No way should any tax dollars go towards funding their new arena!
You are right. It is a waste of tax payer money in terms of return on investment but some things are worth paying taxes for in my opinion because they do provide entertainment and a sense of pride for the community. I would be willing to pay taxes for a quality organization that will invest in the team and truly believes in winning. I don't get that feeling with the Coyotes. I feel like they are trying to pull one over on the Valley. They want another awesome stadium, they want the taxpayers to pay for it and they want to be cheap and not spend money on players. I don't know if their ownership will ever spend the money to compete for a Stanley Cup. And if they are not doing that, no one will watch them. This isn't Canada where there is nothing to do aside from watching hockey and people will foolishly support the team no matter what.
For once, I wish the Valley got an owner like Mark Cuban who has money and wants to win a championship. If we got an owner like that, the Valley would sell out those stadiums. When we Colangelo, the Suns sold out every year. Since Sarver has taken over, the team can't sell tickets; he is another cheap owner who doesn't care about winning.
Going back to this, it is interesting to read the feedback. I don't get the impression that anyone is going to support taxpayer money going toward their stadium. I have a feeling the Coyotes will be going back to the drawing board.
Fortunately Las Vegas got a very rich owner for their new NHL team. The casino built the stadium without public funds. And now the billionaire will put money into getting good players. He's stated publicly he wants a Stanley Cup within 8 years or so.
On the flip side, talk of getting the Oakland Raiders to Las Vegas had the government put up a whopping $700 million dollars toward building a new stadium to lure them there. Whether the NFL owners vote to do that is another story. But that is a ridiculous amount of money for the taxpayer to foot, with NO ROI at all!
You are right that Michael took over about the same time they moved to UOPS however, Bill Bidwill made the remark a couple of times when he owned the team in the 90s that they team lacked the money to invest in itself and had to outspend other teams to retain talent. The new stadium is a huge part of why the Cardinals have become our best local team.
On the flip side, talk of getting the Oakland Raiders to Las Vegas had the government put up a whopping $700 million dollars toward building a new stadium to lure them there. Whether the NFL owners vote to do that is another story. But that is a ridiculous amount of money for the taxpayer to foot, with NO ROI at all!
While, technically, the $750 million Las Vegas/Nevada is "throwing" at the Raiders for a new stadium is public money, it is coming from a 1.4% increase in the hotel tax, so while the public is paying that $750 million, it is the "visiting public" and not the local taxpayers footing the bill. Hotel/car rental taxes are a very popular way to fund new arenas/ballparks/stadiums all over the United States, no matter if they are major league or minor league venues. If Vegas lands a Super Bowl every 5 to 7 years, they will be getting that $750 million back eventually.
You are right that Michael took over about the same time they moved to UOPS however, Bill Bidwill made the remark a couple of times when he owned the team in the 90s that they team lacked the money to invest in itself and had to outspend other teams to retain talent. The new stadium is a huge part of why the Cardinals have become our best local team.
HaHa, right. An NFL team with that very lucrative NFL profit sharing definitely HAD the money, they were cheap and oftentimes $10-12 Million UNDER the salary cap season after season. I had tried to support the Cardinals (I'm a lifelong Charger fan who relocated here from So Cal), but when I saw the stars not getting re-signed and going elsewhere so they can save a few million, I knew it was a sinking ship I couldn't get behind. They definitely changed when Michael took over, but it was too late for me.
I agree that the location has some doing with their attendance but in all actuality the team really stinks. There never seems to be any energy at the games and if there is it's from opposing fans. We were just there Saturday night against the B's and I've never been to a more boring, dull game.
I've seen games from Montreal - Miami and this team is down right boring to watch. Granted this isn't Canada but even the Florida Panthers have exciting games and their fans are crazy (back when they'd throw fake rats on the ice). I've seen many games here and just never felt any energy from the fans or the team like in other arenas. I'd like to see them stay as it's nice to have a home town team but honestly I don't ever see them being a top contender unless like mentioned before you get an owner with deep pockets willing to shell out big money for big name players.
Correct me if I'm wrong but when the Cards moved to UOP Michael Bidwill took over the team as president. Almost the same scenario as the Blackhawks were in when the older Wirtz owned the team and never spent the money needed to make the team competitive. Like Michael once Rocky took over from his dad and started spending money on players the team started to take off (3 cups in 6 years). I don't see the Yotes doing any of this with their current owners. A nice new arena won't win you championships especially when your players are mediocre at best. No way should any tax dollars go towards funding their new arena!
The problem is with the philosophy of the organization. It's a defense first style and its been that way for 10 years. They don't score points. They have no young exciting offensive players. A problem is with their management. They don't know even know how to tank well. For as bad as our team has been, we should have drafted 1st overall at least once or twice in the last 10 years to get a real playmaker and someone to build your organization around. We haven't done that. So the team is flat out boring to watch. You can't blame the community for having no emotional investment in the team when there are no stars on this team. Case in point, Austin Matthews is going to be the 1st overall pick and is from Scottsdale. They should have traded players, acquired picks and tanked the season to get the first pick to draft Matthews...pretty simple right...nope they can't even get that part right.
So it's not just an east valley thing. People in the east valley won't pay to see that boring style of hockey either. Again, this isn't some small town in Canada that lacks an NFL, NBA and MLB team among great weather and lots of outdoor and other amenities to offer. There is so much to do here that you have to give people a reason to pay to watch you play. Thus far the Coyotes haven't shown that.
Regarding energy, it's a Phoenix element. Fans are too nice and laid back here. They are not critical and are easily content with mediocre play as long as the player is a good person off the field and he gave effort. You don't have the same level of passion and expectations that you see from fans in other cities. Our local media is the same way. They don't call out the local teams or ownership. They are too afraid of not getting access so they perpetually kiss the arse of the teams.
You are right that Michael took over about the same time they moved to UOPS however, Bill Bidwill made the remark a couple of times when he owned the team in the 90s that they team lacked the money to invest in itself and had to outspend other teams to retain talent. The new stadium is a huge part of why the Cardinals have become our best local team.
Oh, they had money, they just didn't want to spend it. They didn't want to spend any money until they got a new stadium. It is true that a new staidum allowed them to spend more money but it's not like they didn't have any money before the team was in Glendale. Bill was just cheap and didn't care because he wasn't from here. But Michael grew up here and faced a lot of criticism for his dad being cheap so he had pride and didn't want to lose. Michael is the biggest reason we are winning.
A new stadium will not compensate for mediocre play on the ice. Boring hockey that has no offense or scoring will not attract fans regardless of how nice the stadium is. The reality is people just don't have time. They are not going to take time out of their busy lifestyle to see hockey during a week day if they can't put a good product on the ice.
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