davis, CA nice? (San Francisco, Fresno, Sacramento: for sale, apartment, rental)

[christeen]

Wow, thanks all for the sobering () perspectives, everyone.

Originally Posted by Cayceincali

. . .I want to clearly state that it is a good town for younger kids. When I read my own stuff here like this it sounds like there is not much to like, there are good things about Davis, I am just trying to point out the harder stuff as a mom of teens in this area. . . .

I appreciate this from you and everyone who's been posting here (I love this forum!). Part of why we're thinking of moving out of Napa is because the middle- and high-schools are not very well regarded. We're trying to plan for our (now 3yo) daughter's future, but it's so hard to predict how schools and cities will change in the next 10 years. And it's hard to know just how good or bad a city is compared to others, since drugs, gangs, crime, etc are so pervasive. I really appreciate hearing the good and bad from all of you so we can go in with our eyes open.

And thanks for all the links (crime mapper was cool). I did find some of the info after I searched more. I'm too cheap to pay to read the Enterprise online, but I found the Aggie article ok. Any other Davis message boards or places to find updates on what will happen w/ the school budget cuts? I realize they're happening across the state, but I'd like to know what the district's response/plan is going to be. And is there going to be a mass exodus of teachers from the district?

Originally Posted by aggiealum

The Woodland high schools were something we were worried about. However, when it comes down to it, it's the parents, not the schools that have the most influence on the child's education. We're also hoping that when our kids attend highschool (we don't have any yet), that would be ample time for the city to really fix their school system (or at least try to get it at par). With what seems like an influx of Davis residents to Woodland, we hope that that would play a role in Woodland's schools improving. . . ..

I can totally relate. We've also been hoping the Napa schools will improve as we see a lot of Bay Area transplants in the area who tend to be pretty educated and involved with their kids.

Originally Posted by aggiealum

The high home values in Davis have prevented new families or families that rent from moving/buying to/in Davis, hence the declining enrollment in schools. It's no secret that Davis has THE best schools in the area, if not the state. But why is there declining enrollment at the best schools in the area? Just goes to show that new families or families that rent are shying away from/moving out of Davis. . . .

So who's buying the houses in Davis? Are they Bay Area transplants, or wealthy Sacramento transplants? I've noticed the prices coming down some since last year when we first starting keeping an eye on the market. And newer homes in the outer parts of town seem relatively affordable at least compared to the Bay Area.

Originally Posted by angelbug

My son goes there - Da Vinci High - it's a New Tech Foundation school. It's part of the public school system. The kids take 4 core courses per year at DVHS, but can take anything else they want at Davis High School. Da Vinci is a fantastic school. My son is graduating this June and has never missed a day of school there except when he's been on a school-sponsored trip. He truly loves going there, and the project-oriented teaching methods really engage the kids and teach them critical thinking skills, instead of training them to become what I call "perfect parrots."
. . .

Sounds like a great program. There's a New Technology High in Napa that also seems better than the regular school. And it sounds like it addresses a question I have with all these schools that have high API's, etc, whether they're helping kids learn to think, not just pass tests. Does your son like the school? Does he see the same drug, monied/entitled kids issues that others have discussed here?

Originally Posted by angelbug

. . .Yep, that's where Davis has been exceedingly short-sighted, IMO. A lot of my sales tax dollars go to Woodland. We're getting a Target, but it only passed the vote by less than one percent, and has to be LEED-certified and have a bunch of trees in the parking lot, which is just going to make it hard to keep your car clean when you park under them. I understand the desire to keep Davis small with little independent businesses, but I think it's kind of hypocritical to promote green living and then make yourselves have to drive 10-15 miles to buy anything.

That makes a lot of sense to me. Especially since I do an awful lot of consuming at Target (and Trader Joe's -- they're coming too, right?). Very un-Davis like of me, I know.

Originally Posted by Cayceincali

Well about the drugs with high schoolers.... my son who is 17 and pretty honest has said that there is plenty of cocaine available and most kids have to the cash to make the purchases, every party he has gone to has pot and alcohol. Kids smoke on campus (UCD) in the gardens at at the arboretum. I guess the real problem is that other than weekend parties there is nothing for them to do.... like live music, hanging out at the beach, horse ridding, hiking, snowboarding........ I think the other part is that these kids have plenty of spending money, cars and limited responsibility. There are a lot of totally crappy low lifes that know these kids have money so they don't have to look for drugs, if your downtown they will find you!

Originally Posted by clairerandall

When I was in high school, it was the (sad) hidden joke that the best parties with the most alcohol were the ones thrown by the D.A.R.E. club. Not kidding. Yes, drugs are VERY available, mainly because there are tons of college parties all over town that have no problem including high school kids..

Ok, that's depressing, especially about the DARE club. Of course, if I were in high school that would be funny, but now that I"m a mom . . . And my husband was not happy to hear that his precious daughter would some day have easy access to college parties. Ugh. Do you guys think this is much worse than other towns, or at least other towns where the kids have access to the money? Is it worse since it's a college town?

Originally Posted by clairerandall

Racial tension is really weird in the school system. On one hand, the district does promote diversity. You graduate thinking that you are open to other races. But you quickly find out in the real world that you had no idea what the heck you were talking about. It is one thing to say you are open. It is another thing to realize that having only 5 African American students in your graduating class does not make your community diverse (no exaggeration). To me it seems that every ten years or so a really strangely violent racial incident happens at Davis High.

That is sad. I'd thought Davis was much more diverse than that. Doesn't sound much better than Napa in that regard. I read about the Vietnamese kid stabbed to death 25 years ago -- are there more incidents like that? Ugh. On the other hand, I think it's good that you at least think you're open-minded when you leave school. At least they're trying, which I don't think is true in all places.

Originally Posted by clairerandall

Davis High had a long history of promoting their 0% dropout rate. This was accomplished by sending all academically questionable students to a continuation school which was a complete joke in terms of academic quality. Students who attended there told me that for some assignments, such as reading a book, they would be asked to draw a picture about the assignment. I'm not joking. Since 1997 the dropout rate has begun to increase, which is fine because it was reduced, I believe, by artificial methods that did not support struggling students.

Was there a change in the school or district administration in 1997 to cause that change? That's very interesting. Pretty pathetic, but interesting. Again, thanks for all the info and insights!


Thanks again everyone for the enlightening discussion!

[clairerandall]

Those buying the houses...well, some could be professorial transplants who are senior and offered good salaries (say $80-90k). UC offers faculty mortgages at under 2% so they can afford to live in Davis. A LOT of investors buy/bought in Davis, because the rental market is so tight (always!) they can afford to rent at exorbitant amounts to college kids. For the rest, probably Bay Area or Sac transplants with plenty of money.

Trader Joe's will never come to Davis, unless pigs fly or the City Council gets desperate or actaully listens to its citizens. I used to work there, so I know. Trader Joe's is non-union and they've gotten very poor reception from the City of Davis because of that. What a shame. They have better pay and benefits than many other grocery stores.

I don't think there has been another stabbing, but there were incidents of white kids beating up on kids of other backgrounds. I have no idea why, or why that tension exists. And yes, I've heard that the district administration is getting better. Otherwise DaVinci High would never have opened.

I hate to sound cheesy, but on the drugs/partying thing, it's totally going to depend on how your kid turns out. I knew where to buy drugs and alcohol (but I had no money). I hung out with the kids that did drugs. But I never did them. Not just the money thing, I just couldn't see the point in looking as stupid as the kids did who actually did them. No one looks suave on drugs. I got invited to the college parties by the frat boys, but I also never went to them--I had enough sense to realize it was not smart to go into a place of a bunch of drunk older guys.

Curfews are wonderful things.

If you have a daughter who turns out valuing learning and working for opportunities like college (and a greater chance of this happening in Davis schools is possible), she will self-regulate and you can rest.

If you have a daughter who turns out a wild child, I would worry less than if I lived in Sacramento or most other communities.

[Cayceincali]

Clairerandall,
thank you for speaking up and out about these issues. I am often seen in the Davis parent realm as way off base with my take on things in this town for teens. I have two kids that report the same..... and yes, King High is the unfortunate answer to kids that are not over achieving in the Davis system. One of my co-workers was told she should forget about college and look into a "clean up" job at UCD as this would be a better long term option for her, stated by a teacher!! They told her about her getting benefits if she stayed employed long enough with UCD. She however went to UCD after having to take many classes at Sac City college to get caught up to a senior in high school education, after graduating from King high.

I am not sure why Davis parents would rather not know what is really going on with their kids and the stress at the high schools, if they knew I am sure they would help change things. My son is right now at a party with parents home and he asked us to pick him up because he doubted there would be a sober ride at 11pm.

I don't see the diversity either....... sadly to say. And we were just talking over coffee about the Jr high boy wo hung himself as a result of reentless teasing as noted in his letter to his parents and the boy who was pushed in front of the train by peers...... it is sad that the knowledge of their deaths did not change the climate in Davis schools. Many new comers can be lulled into a false comfort, their kids may be with holding really troubling feelings as a result of being in a town of "perfect kids " .

My kids have expressed feelings of guilt at times for the kids who can't keep up because they don't get as much focus and attention from the teachers...... it is one thing if you don't do the work but those who do and still struggle need encouragement not King High, teachers have used it as a threat as in, "do you want to attend King next year?" Very odd indeed....

I am sorry you had such a hard time, from the sounds of it you have a big new outlook on the world around you THANK YOU for sharing your views and insight from a personal level.

[Cayceincali]

I think the party problem is a combination issue, the most over looked is the fact that parents don't think it is in this town! If they did not have this rosy glow over Davis they would be more aware of what their ids might be up to, less trusting that these 15-17 year olds are going to have a picnic on campus!! For the love of God, we were teens once what do you really think they are doing?????? And no the school does not need cash for the class project they take checks........ the latest is I want to spot the poor kid to a movie and food so they get extra cash and pool their money for party supplies..... I know because my kids talk and I work with teens as a life coach who have been busted. I have had to drop many of them because they did not want support to get on the right track their parents wanted them to get on the right track. The parents don't understand why after a month I evaluate them to see if they are invested, if not I see it as a waste of money. Most report that they are not addicts they are just regular kids who got caught, no problem here. We have all been teens we should know the ropes without the kids telling us what is going on! I think that is the problem, Davis does not want to admit there is a problem. My kids dad works at Da Vinci the teachers are having a hard time there as well. 4 years is new in my mind and it is not on its own campus so it has the same concerns because it is part of Davis high, it is a wonderful option and I know many of the students that attend this school are happy to participate in the classes it offers.

My message is "wake up Davis there is a problem" it is fixable but you have to not be blind to it and where your kids are and what they are really up to.

[christeen]

Agreed -- haven't even decided if we're moving to Davis, but also give my thanks to clairerandall for speaking out. Reading your post makes me hopeful a kid can turn out okay even in today's climate. Don't want to sound too patronizing (and I realize you're an adult now), but your parents should be proud.

Cayce, I'm glad at least you're there trying to wake people up and help the kids who are trying (don't go to NC! ). I doubt Davis is the only community with its head in the sand when it comes to these issues. That is a tough job you have, only tougher because you don't seem to have the parental support/understanding (which I realize is part of why there's a problem to begin with . . .).

Glad to hear Da Vinci is promising even as it sits amidst the Davis High atmosphere. King sounds so sad, and sickening how it's being used. I hope the newer administration is waking up and starts working with all the kids.

And too bad about Trader Joes, I really love that place and agree they treat their employees well from what I've heard. (But I didn't think Target was union either -- how'd they get in?).

[clairerandall]

I think Trader Joe's has been rebuffed so many times maybe they don't want to try again. They told me in 2001 (oh god it feels like yesterday!) when I worked there that reason--who knows, maybe the City Council is more receptive now b/c of Starbucks and Target, and maybe they will come back.

Oh gosh, I totally forgot about Andrew Mockus til you mentioned it, caycincali. That happened when I was in junior high.

[Augie Daugie]

I used to live in Davis. The town is becoming overrun with baby boomers who set extreme growth limits and prevent younger generations from being able to own a home in the community. As mentioned earlier, the town is losing a lot of its cultural essence in favor of chain retailers and yuppy boutiques. For living in, it is still nice. The farmer's market is one of the coolest community events around.

[darby astor]

I have lived in Davis for 10 years. The students that I've met at UCD who grew up in Davis seem really sheltered to me. I am originally from the Bay Area and I am used to seeing museums, lots of diversity, people eating all types of cuisines, having many types of life experience, etc. On the other hand, other Davis local kids are extremely entitled - it seems like all the high school kids drive SUVs and have all the latest gadgets and clothes. Younger kids don't seem to be disciplined all that much (boomer parents). I am in restaurants and stores all the time and kids are making brats of themselves. I have seen many times, young kids (i.e. 10 yrs old and younger) with the fancy ipods - I don't know what that's all about.

The city council is always trying to raise taxes to pay for the parks (don't know why their existing budget doesn't cover this) and I don't know why but the voters always approve of these new taxes. The students never turn out to vote so invariably these things pass and affect them more than the homeowners.

Also, don't be a Republican in Davis. Though Davis claims to be tolerant of everything, they aren't.

[aggiealum]

Anyone think Trader Joe's would be interested in Woodland? To me, a Costco, Target, and Trader Joe's in one shopping complex would be the only place I'd ever have to go to get anything I want. I've already gone on Trader Joe's request a location and requested Woodland. If Davis people (who will travel north to Costco) want a Trader Joe's, why not request one where we're all headed anyways?

[Natasajv]

Hi,

it is very nice (and quiet) to live in Davis, great place to raise children, biking everywhere, farmer's market etc. Most people work at the Univ. if you can get the job there, lot of people commute to Sacramento, some even to Bay area. Real estate and rents are expensive, vacancy rates low.