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Old 01-10-2012, 09:43 PM
 
442 posts, read 1,077,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Albertine View Post
I just had the same thing happen to me. I was a sustitute teacher and when the regular teacher came back there was no place for me. These things happen, the most important thing to do now is NOT to start questioning yourself and doubting your teaching skills. Your colleagues and students think you are a good teacher, that is the best feedback you can get. You'll get a new job, with an administrator that appreciates you for who you are and wants to have you on their team.

Still, you have received constructive criticism, and that might be worth looking into. This way you'll know what to do differently.

Best of luck to the both of us!

BTW, you were not fired, your contract wasn't renewed. Big difference.
Distinction without a difference. The OP was fired. It was not a RIF, and it wasn't a temporary or grant-funded position.

The ONLY difference between a non-renewal and a dismissal is the "dismissal" occurs AFTER one receives tenure. A "tenured" teacher has the right to a rigged hearing which almost always goes in favor of the idiot principal. Both, however, are firings.
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Old 01-10-2012, 09:46 PM
 
442 posts, read 1,077,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by endersshadow View Post
Yeah, the "not a good fit" line is like saying "it's not you, it's me". He's just being diplomatic. If he liked you, there's no reason why you wouldn't "fit" in that school.

Last year was my first year as a teacher. My contract was not being renewed either, and I (essentially) had the option of resigning or being fired. Most employers give the former option, so that the employees walk away quietly. The employee can walk away saying he didn't get fired... but future employers do have to wonder why you left.

By the way, I'm finishing up my second year as a teacher. I've had an amazing year, and my new principal gave me a great evaluation. So don't fret too much over this bump.


I agree. Teachers can get away with some crazy stuff when they have tenure. However, while you're on probation, you're walking on egg shells. Don't stir the pot and always be happy. I have a colleague that's in her first year, and she stirs the pot (in the best interest of her students). Fortunately for her, our principal values effective AND dedicated teachers. She's both.
"A good fit" is a euphemism for being not wanted for whatever idiotic reason a principal has. Since most principals are failed teachers themselves and are the least capable people to be supervising others with the unlimited power they have, they can say whatever they want. They can make up charges against teachers, even and especially tenured teachers, with the knowledge the district and legal system will always back them up. Administrative law does not protect teachers.
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Old 01-10-2012, 09:49 PM
 
442 posts, read 1,077,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MsT89 View Post
I'm sorry to hear that your contract was not renewed. That is so disheartening! The same thing happened to me two years ago, after 15 years of teaching (no tenure where I am).

One thing I learned from that experience is to be very careful what you say about it in your interviews. Some applications will ask if you have ever had a contract not renewed. The follow-up question in the interview is usually something broad like "Tell me about that situation." When I was too honest in my answers, I didn't get good results. When I kept my answer broad, but still truthful and focused on moving forward, things went better.

Good luck with your interview. I hope you find a new job that's the right fit for both you and the school.
Given the worsening economy, the application question is a weeding-out question, and almost all districts require online applications. You never get the opportunity to explain your side because districts will pick those with a clean record.

The best way to "start over" is to go either private school or charter. Public schools are absolutely the worst outfits to work for because of the filthy politics. If you insist on working public, those alternatives can give you a way to worm your way back into "the system." You will likely have to relocate, though.

Last edited by tonysam; 01-10-2012 at 10:10 PM..
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Old 01-10-2012, 09:51 PM
 
442 posts, read 1,077,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teachbeach View Post
Your contract was not renewed. Period. No further explanation is necessary. They can't ask (you or the former district), and you don't have to provide any more information.
Actually, many school districts require a reference from the last principal. If a district demands that, avoid that district because you will never get hired.
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Old 01-10-2012, 09:54 PM
 
442 posts, read 1,077,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Albertine View Post
Nope. Firing impiles terminating an existing contract. Not the case here.
No. It is a firing. You have an existing contract when you are non-renewed. The principal simply doesn't offer you a job for the next year. It is denying you the right to a continuing contract or a job. It is not a RIF. You are terminated because the principal didn't think you cut the mustard as a teacher or whatever stupid reason he or she thinks; therefore, you are fired. You are an at-will employee when you are probationary, with no guarantee of a job. When a principal ditches you, you are fired. Period.

The ONLY difference between a non-renewal and a "dismissal" is a tenured teacher has a right to a hearing, but the two are the same thing.

Let's quit splitting hairs. If a district doesn't renew your contract, you are fired. You are not laid off and therefore you are fired. As an aside, you can still get UI if you are fired (apart from "gross misconduct"). Non-renewal is worse than an outright dismissal (outside of criminal conduct) because at least you were considered good enough to attain tenure when you were dismissed and you can at least theoretically fight it through the kangaroo hearings and the court system if you are in a protected class.

Being non-renewed outside of a RIF or a temporary contract is usually a career killer unless the teacher is willing to relocate far from the district that fired him or her or move out of state.

Last edited by tonysam; 01-10-2012 at 10:20 PM..
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Old 01-11-2012, 06:58 AM
 
6,565 posts, read 14,290,938 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Froggie Legs View Post
The school district is just the one school...so no.

I'll just be honest and, if asked, say that I wasn't given a clear reason for the non-renewal. With the 6 letters of reference from my co-workers, many of whom came into my classroom and watched me teach, I'm not worried about my ability. I really think it goes back to holding students accountable (which, silly me, is what I thought teachers were supposed to do!)

good advice though, will keep my head down the next round. I do love teaching and won't give up as long as there are students to teach!
Based on the bolded and today's school environment?

My guess is you pissed off some parents who went to your administrator about you DARING to hold their children "accountable".

You aren't "wrong" per se, but yeah you need to tread lightly as a school employee these days. Unfortunately the inmates run the asylum (Parents, and consequently the kids).
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Old 01-11-2012, 07:03 AM
 
6,565 posts, read 14,290,938 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonysam View Post
No. It is a firing. You have an existing contract when you are non-renewed. The principal simply doesn't offer you a job for the next year. It is denying you the right to a continuing contract or a job. It is not a RIF. You are terminated because the principal didn't think you cut the mustard as a teacher or whatever stupid reason he or she thinks; therefore, you are fired. You are an at-will employee when you are probationary, with no guarantee of a job. When a principal ditches you, you are fired. Period.

The ONLY difference between a non-renewal and a "dismissal" is a tenured teacher has a right to a hearing, but the two are the same thing.

Let's quit splitting hairs. If a district doesn't renew your contract, you are fired. You are not laid off and therefore you are fired. As an aside, you can still get UI if you are fired (apart from "gross misconduct"). Non-renewal is worse than an outright dismissal (outside of criminal conduct) because at least you were considered good enough to attain tenure when you were dismissed and you can at least theoretically fight it through the kangaroo hearings and the court system if you are in a protected class.

Being non-renewed outside of a RIF or a temporary contract is usually a career killer unless the teacher is willing to relocate far from the district that fired him or her or move out of state.
It isn't "splitting hairs" when you're looking for another job. Most applications these day specifically ask, "Have you ever been fired?" and this technicality can be the difference between being honest or lying on an application.

This is how schools let somebody go without trashing their future prospects. So yeah, the OP can and should just stick with, "My contract ended" and leave it at that... It isn't the BEST thing to have to say in an interview, but it isn't the worst...
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Old 01-11-2012, 07:31 AM
 
Location: On the brink of WWIII
21,088 posts, read 29,206,191 times
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Many schools are posting positions as "interim" or contingent on funding and not guarenteed renewal.
I have also known schools that hired a new teachers every year or two for some positions like English, or SpEd.
Any more a lot of districta are letting teachers go just before gaining tenure. So how can one be acceptable for 2-3 years and just as tenure comes up they are no longer a good fit? Sry about the tangent.
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Old 01-11-2012, 07:34 AM
 
16,431 posts, read 22,189,163 times
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I'd call it a lay off or a contract completion.
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Old 01-11-2012, 09:12 AM
 
Location: St Louis, MO
4,677 posts, read 5,764,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonysam View Post
Let's quit splitting hairs. If a district doesn't renew your contract, you are fired. You are not laid off and therefore you are fired. As an aside, you can still get UI if you are fired (apart from "gross misconduct"). Non-renewal is worse than an outright dismissal (outside of criminal conduct) because at least you were considered good enough to attain tenure when you were dismissed and you can at least theoretically fight it through the kangaroo hearings and the court system if you are in a protected class.

Being non-renewed outside of a RIF or a temporary contract is usually a career killer unless the teacher is willing to relocate far from the district that fired him or her or move out of state.
I think this has be considered on a state by state basis too. In some states, being non-renewed as a teacher does not allow you to collect UI. As far as the state is concerned, you have not been fired. By the same token, some states operate in a mode where it is expected that a teacher will be non-renewed several times before they are allowed to reach tenure. Missouri operates like this (where tenure takes 5 years, and it is standard practice to non-renew any teacher who takes or will take significant time off).
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