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Old 04-01-2024, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
17,208 posts, read 57,041,396 times
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Sorry for the short notice but I just heard about this today. Usually ATC has some decent discussions.

So it will be in the afternoon/evening of April 1 2024. And no, I'm not making an April Fool joke out of it.

Perhaps we can discuss on here after listening.
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Old 04-01-2024, 05:45 PM
 
4,381 posts, read 4,231,250 times
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I didn't hear anything new in the segment. Low pay, lowering of already poor student behavior, and increased politicization of teaching. There was nothing to tempt me to return to the classroom. I really, really miss teaching French--several teaching dreams a week, mostly good, but I know better than to sign a contract with conditions being what they are. Instead, I'll keep teaching adults to be junior software developers for half the pay and zero stress.
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Old 04-01-2024, 07:14 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,762 posts, read 24,261,465 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lhpartridge View Post
I didn't hear anything new in the segment. Low pay, lowering of already poor student behavior, and increased politicization of teaching. There was nothing to tempt me to return to the classroom. I really, really miss teaching French--several teaching dreams a week, mostly good, but I know better than to sign a contract with conditions being what they are. Instead, I'll keep teaching adults to be junior software developers for half the pay and zero stress.
I've been retired now for over a decade, and everything I read, particularly here on this forum, makes me glad I'm out of it. And I LOVED my teaching career and LOVED my administrative career. It all sound so ugly now.
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Old 04-01-2024, 09:33 PM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,690 posts, read 57,994,855 times
Reputation: 46171
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
Sorry for the short notice but I just heard about this today. Usually ATC has some decent discussions.

...

Perhaps we can discuss on here after listening.
Also today (npr)

https://www.marketplace.org/shows/ma...ment-conundrum

The public school enrollment conundrum. 40% drop in enrollment in some districts. (Yikes, the government funding dries up with reduced enrollment)

Sounds like a win:win.... Fewer teachers needed for few students.

Now to get more dead weight to take early retirement, or preferably quit sooner than later.
(as well articulated in industry)... " Do the company (schools and students) a BIG favor.... and GOHOME!"

Freakonomics has some really good series on education, with very learned, knowledgeable, experienced, and insightful academia leaders. (I.e. not Dead weight, YCDT whiners)
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Old 04-01-2024, 10:13 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,762 posts, read 24,261,465 times
Reputation: 32905
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
Also today (npr)

https://www.marketplace.org/shows/ma...ment-conundrum

The public school enrollment conundrum. 40% drop in enrollment in some districts. (Yikes, the government funding dries up with reduced enrollment)

Sounds like a win:win.... Fewer teachers needed for few students.

Now to get more dead weight to take early retirement, or preferably quit sooner than later.
(as well articulated in industry)... " Do the company (schools and students) a BIG favor.... and GOHOME!"

Freakonomics has some really good series on education, with very learned, knowledgeable, experienced, and insightful academia leaders. (I.e. not Dead weight, YCDT whiners)
Better is this: https://www.brookings.edu/articles/b...%20top%20third).
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Old 04-02-2024, 03:26 PM
 
Location: WA
5,439 posts, read 7,726,033 times
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There isn't one single market for teachers. There are thousands of separate markets in districts across the country.

States and localities that are desirable places to live and that provide teachers with reasonable salaries and benefits rarely have teacher shortages. They have waiting lists and many multiple applicants per job.

States and localities that are not desirable places to live (for young educated people) and that do not provide decent salaries and benefits have great difficulty finding teachers. That trend has only increased as we have become a more mobile and urban society and young people are less inclined to move back home to rural and small town America after college compared to generations past. Both because the country is more global, but also because small town and rural America is a lot crappier than it used to be.

None of this is any great mystery. It's the same reason why small town and rural America has a hard time attracting any sort of professionals.
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Old 04-04-2024, 04:34 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
17,208 posts, read 57,041,396 times
Reputation: 18559
Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthRabbit View Post
Also today (npr)

https://www.marketplace.org/shows/ma...ment-conundrum

The public school enrollment conundrum. 40% drop in enrollment in some districts. (Yikes, the government funding dries up with reduced enrollment)

Sounds like a win:win.... Fewer teachers needed for few students.

Now to get more dead weight to take early retirement, or preferably quit sooner than later.
(as well articulated in industry)... " Do the company (schools and students) a BIG favor.... and GOHOME!"

Freakonomics has some really good series on education, with very learned, knowledgeable, experienced, and insightful academia leaders. (I.e. not Dead weight, YCDT whiners)
Yakima (city) school district just had a significant layoff, driven by reduced enrollment. Not sure if it was a voluntary or involuntary layoff, and with the teachers being unionized, you can't just go in and kick out the worst performers, even if you have objective evidence as to who they are.

Of course in most voluntary reductions in force, the best performers are the first to leave, and if you have an involuntary, all the affirmative action hires have to be kept, lest you appear to be less than woke, and a lot of these are not likely to ever be accused of being the sharpest tool in the shed.

As Dr. Thomas Sowell said in a different context: "There are no solutions, there are only tradeoffs."
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Old 04-07-2024, 06:57 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,327 posts, read 60,500,026 times
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Anybody who didn't see the current teacher shortage coming twenty or more years ago wasn't paying attention, and that's not taking into account the recent Covid/post-Covid issues that have arisen.

I make that statement because that was when the Baby Boom generation of teachers started to retire. Just like in the population at large that generation was a bulge in the teacher corps and weren't being replaced.

Add that the push of many colleges that were historically "teacher colleges" downgrading that aspect of their mission (the college I attended started to do that when I was there in the 1970s. It started to bill itself as a Business Administration college even though it still had "State Teachers College" in the name, although that did change).

My youngest daughter had to jump through about a dozen hoops to get into the teacher program at a large Maryland University, known as a major teacher school, fifteen years ago. One advisor even went so far as to state that the demand for teachers was crashing. That was at a time when almost every school system in the state was understaffed and bringing in teachers from other countries. That was in every subject, not just the ones you'd expect in STEM.
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Old 04-07-2024, 09:53 AM
 
Location: WA
5,439 posts, read 7,726,033 times
Reputation: 8543
Again. There isn't actually a teacher shortage in this country. Because there isn't one single market for teachers in this country. Many parts of the country have teacher surpluses. Attractive cities and towns in states that support teachers with decent salaries and benefits have absolutely no trouble attracting teachers.

What we actually have is a situation where individual districts and even whole states are unable to attract teachers because they are not offering appealing combinations of location, salary, benefits, and working conditions. And teachers have other choices.
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Old 04-07-2024, 11:14 AM
 
4,381 posts, read 4,231,250 times
Reputation: 5859
Quote:
Originally Posted by texasdiver View Post
Again. There isn't actually a teacher shortage in this country. Because there isn't one single market for teachers in this country. Many parts of the country have teacher surpluses. Attractive cities and towns in states that support teachers with decent salaries and benefits have absolutely no trouble attracting teachers.

What we actually have is a situation where individual districts and even whole states are unable to attract teachers because they are not offering appealing combinations of location, salary, benefits, and working conditions. And teachers have other choices.
You're right. There isn't a teacher shortage, even in areas where districts can't find enough qualified candidates to fill all classrooms. There is a shortage of people who are willing and able to teach under the current conditions.

When all districts have to offer is low pay and poor working conditions, the rewards of teaching are not enough to offset all the crap that goes along with the good stuff, from atrocious student behavior, to overwhelming administrivia, to complications with the students' families and home lives.
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