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So I had my phone review just under two weeks ago where upon I explained the reasoning for my firing due to an operating disagreement. I know for certain my former employer did not appeal. The deputy informed me if more was needed I would hear within 48 hours. In the mean time we went through the typical questions of what I had been doing in the past 3.5 weeks since my firing, as I had not attempted to claim any benefits during this time (I thought I had to wait until after my review). I informed them I was now searching for work and taking a job training course to get licensed. Three days later a direct deposit was made into my account for the full time I had been laid off, and the following week I requested a direct deposit with no problems.
I received my determination letter yesterday stating I am ineligible from 05/14, as I was not available for work on 05/17 and do not demonstrate availability for employment. My phone call wasn't until 05/24 and I made it very clear that I had been searching and was taking a job training course to further bolster a case to new employers.
I filed an appeal. Was this done to hastily? Am I going to have to return the money already deposited into my account? I never heard back from the deputy and the "pending" determination had disappeared from my case status page. Getting through to the office is a nightmare so any help would be very much appreciated!!!!
taking a job training course to further bolster a case to new employers.
That's called going to school and is disqualifying when it occurs ANYTIME between 8 am and 5 pm Mon to Fri.
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Originally Posted by Confusedpleasehelp
I filed an appeal. Was this done to hastily?
Maybe. Did you say more than "I appeal!" If so, you probably said the wrong things.
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Originally Posted by Confusedpleasehelp
Am I going to have to return the money already deposited into my account?
Only if you lose your appeal, continue to be "not able and available," and only the weeks from 5/14 on a going forward basis.
To win at the appeal hearing, you need to:
Convincingly tell the judge that if you got a job, you'd quit that class immediately, or
Switch the time on the class to get it out of the danger zone times and let the judge know so that you can get a determination that says, "effective sometime after today, you're available."
Show the judge that you already dropped out.
Since it's too late for you, but others may read:
Just say fired, and shut up. The more you talk, the more problems you cause for yourself. File those weekly claims.
Maybe. Did you say more than "I appeal!" If so, you probably said the wrong things.
I responded with 4 bullets in my appeal. One stated on the day they mention I looked for jobs that morning, took part in course modules throughout the day, and spoke with a potential employer by phone as a follow up to an email sent the day prior.
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Originally Posted by Chyvan
Only if you lose your appeal, continue to be "not able and available," and only the weeks from 5/14 on a going forward basis.
OK, my confusion then arises as I'm taking this course online at my own faster pace, which I mentioned during the interview. The reason I chose to take the course online is so that I could take any call or go on any interview at the drop of a hat and wouldn't be physically constrained to a class room.. or the class room's learning speed. How is attempting to acquire a new skill while at the same time search and apply for opportunities frowned upon.
I responded with 4 bullets in my appeal. One stated on the day they mention I looked for jobs that morning, took part in course modules throughout the day, and spoke with a potential employer by phone as a follow up to an email sent the day prior.
You said too much, and it wasn't the right stuff anyway.
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Originally Posted by Confusedpleasehelp
OK, my confusion then arises as I'm taking this course online at my own faster pace, which I mentioned during the interview. The reason I chose to take the course online is so that I could take any call or go on any interview at the drop of a hat and wouldn't be physically constrained to a class room.. or the class room's learning speed.
You had no business telling the UI worker about the class to begin with. However, online classes are permissible, BUT the UI worker chose to ignore what you said and issue the denial. It's just what they do.
That's why you don't want to talk to them, EVER. You just don't know the caliber of the person you're going to get, and now you're going to have to attend an appeal hearing, all because of what came out of your own mouth.
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Originally Posted by Confusedpleasehelp
How is attempting to acquire a new skill while at the same time search and apply for opportunities frowned upon.
The primary goal of UI is to provide you with an income while you look for work. That is it. Upgrading your skills and that "get licensed" part, probably just made that UI worker squeal with glee. If you want to do that, you have to do it properly, and while I think you are with the online classes, you got the book thrown at you.
You'll want your story to be "I do online classes in the evening after 5 pm. I'll drop those classes if I get a job," and don't say one word to suggest that you've got other things on your plate other than looking for work.
However, I suggest that if you can get your money back, you should just pull the plug on the classes. Get confirmation from the school, and then call NJ UI to reopen your claim to get the money flowing back in. Able and available is a week by week disqualification. Once you're not in school, you become able and available, and they will begin to pay you starting with this week provided you didn't do any schooling Sunday or Monday.
If you end up with a stickler of a judge, and you need the UI money, you'll wish you'd just cancelled the class now, rather than waiting another 4 weeks only to have to do it then and be short that much more money.
However, if the class was expensive and you can't get a refund, then I'd be racing to finish that class, so then you can still reopen the claim and show that it's over, and start getting your UI money.
That's honestly very sad to me. I thought I was doing the right thing by mentioning that I was doing more than just look for new work. My goal all along was to fly through the course as quickly as I could so I guess I just have to have even more jump in my step now.
Do you have any idea how long the turnaround is for these appeals? Would you suggest simply holding all deposits received in my bank account in case the appeal is denied?
That's honestly very sad to me. I thought I was doing the right thing by mentioning that I was doing more than just look for new work. My goal all along was to fly through the course as quickly as I could so I guess I just have to have even more jump in my step now.
Lot's of people think they are doing "the right thing," but UI is an illogical complex mess.
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Originally Posted by Confusedpleasehelp
Do you have any idea how long the turnaround is for these appeals?
About 4 to 6 weeks for an appeal hearing.
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Originally Posted by Confusedpleasehelp
Would you suggest simply holding all deposits received in my bank account in case the appeal is denied?
No, spend the money. It's yours right now. There are many things you can do to delay or avoid repaying the money. Never pay money back voluntarily unless there is "fraud" involved. Let things play out.
You have a good story to have a great shot at getting your benefits restored and avoiding an "able and available" issue. It's just next time, get help BEFORE you flap your jaw. You were doing great until you mentioned that class. NEVER think you know what the right answer is with UI.
Just say fired, and shut up. The more you talk, the more problems you cause for yourself. File those weekly claims.
Excellent advice. People confuse the unemployment office with a Confessional. It is not. The more information you give them and try to explain the situation, the more it works against you it seems.
Chyvan does a great service here in City Data answering these questions about unemployment. Too often people think simply because they are out of a job it is their fault and they deserve nothing because the employer led them to believe so. Or they get misinformation about how the process works.
Another thing I'd like to add, the people who work at unemployment and simply doing a desk job. They want things as easy as possible, so simply saying "I was fired" and shut up, allows them to streamline the process.
It is only if you are denied and appeal that you need to focus on the details to make your case.
Excellent advice. People confuse the unemployment office with a Confessional. It is not. The more information you give them and try to explain the situation, the more it works against you it seems.
Chyvan does a great service here in City Data answering these questions about unemployment. Too often people think simply because they are out of a job it is their fault and they deserve nothing because the employer led them to believe so. Or they get misinformation about how the process works.
Another thing I'd like to add, the people who work at unemployment and simply doing a desk job. They want things as easy as possible, so simply saying "I was fired" and shut up, allows them to streamline the process.
It is only if you are denied and appeal that you need to focus on the details to make your case.
Yup, people don't realize that it is up to the employer to prove what you did/didn't do rises to the level of gross misconduct or not. The state also has an interest not to pay out claims it does not have to. Don't do their job for them.
Wellp guess we'll see what happens in 4 to 6 weeks. Hopefully by then this point will be moot and I'll be on to better things! I appreciate the help everyone!
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