We wanted to adopt from US foster care but... (birth mother, African American, orphan)
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Sheena, we are going to have to agree to disagree. Again, I understand where you are coming from but I also know what is going on from the other side (I'm involved in social work). Steps have been taken to sever biological parents rights faster when their behavior is criminal or they are simply not interested in being parents - I have seen it happen. I know of two cases personally where the children were adopted by their foster parents - their only foster parents - in less than two years and both children had been placed with them as infants. It happens.
Every state's laws are different as far as what steps must be taken to remove a child from the home and to terminate rights. I don't know what the laws are where you live. I do know, however, that there are laws the social workers must obey, and contact with the bio family is encouraged even after termination. Maybe mom was terrible, but grandma loved her grandchildren with all her heart. These children shouldn't have to lose everything because their parents made terrible choices.
You and I have different ideas about adoption - I don't think adoption should wipe out the bio family and pretend as though they never existed. That is damaging to the adopted child, whether that child was adopted as an infant from another country or a 7 year old from one city over. Adopted kids have rights too, and their right to know their family needs to be respected.
I fully agree. And luckily the trend of understanding this is shifting away from antiquated beliefs (as posted by the OP) to this more child centered approach. Still lots of work to do.
False, false, false. Look, I agree that in many, many cases biological parents are given WAY too many chances and the children suffer at the hands of the system. I've also seen SO many wonderful, beautiful families formed through foster care. And every single one was younger than 5 at placement. I don't know where you live but I promise you in Hawaii, Colorado, Ohio and Maryland your statements are not true. I'm sorry you've had bad experiences. There is no doubt the U.S. is in desperate need of having the entire foster care system overhauled. But please don't scare away potential foster/adoptive parents with such sweeping generalizations. The children cannot afford it.
Anyway, what you have to understand that it IS important for these kids to have acknowledgement of their biological parents, even if you don't like it. If the kids are old enough to remember mom or dad, then they need to feel they have a place to express their feelings, thoughts, and memories about mom or dad, even if mom or dad turned out to be horrible, horrible people. They need a safe place to process all of that, and who could be safer than the people who chose them. They can't just be expected to forget about them or shut down their feelings because their new mom and dad don't want to acknowledge their connection to their biological parents. These kids are sad, scared, angry, and they have a right to their feelings and a right to express them. If you can't handle that then, no, you shouldn't take them in. But don't blame the system because social workers know that the kids need that acknowledgement.
I believe you have misunderstood the OP's point. I did not read in her post anything that suggests that adopted kids should be dissuaded from expressing their feelings about their birth parents. What she is saying is that she does not want to have an ongoing relationship with people who caused physical harm to her would-be adopted children:
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheena12
We were asked if we could maintain a relation ship with a woman who put her child in a full body cast. Could we light a candle on mother's day to remember a woman who left her child alone for three days or permited her boyfriend to beat or molest the child?
Our answer was no. We want a family. Not a therapeutic group home.
I am in total agreement with sheena12. I would not want any kind of contact, much less an on-going relationship, with anyone who could be so violent against an innocent child. Indeed, I will go so far as to say that, IMO, the "open adoption" pendulum is swinging too far in the wrong direction. Personally, I don't want to share my parenting with another set of people who may have very different views of what is right and wrong in child rearing. My kids deserve to be raised by a single, unified set of parents -- not a group of people trying to negotiate their way through things.
There are reasons why we adopted internationally instead of domestically. And one of the big ones is that we, my wife and I, wanted to be the sole parents; we were not interested in any kind of co-parenting arrangement with birth parents or with anyone else. If this puts me out of step with the current adoption philosophy, then so be it.
You and I have different ideas about adoption - I don't think adoption should wipe out the bio family and pretend as though they never existed. That is damaging to the adopted child, whether that child was adopted as an infant from another country or a 7 year old from one city over. Adopted kids have rights too, and their right to know their family needs to be respected.
I agree that adoption shouldn't erase the bio family either. A child does have the right to know as much about their biological family as possible when the age and time is right. Both of my children know the basics. This is not something we dwell on nor do they wish to dwell on it. In fact, they really don't want to discuss it at this point in their lives and I respect their feelings. What gives me the right to force something down their throats? When they are adults, I will give them the full information what I have and know. It isn't a pretty picture and some of the narratives are quite painful. They are free to reach out but in their cases, not advisable. They are both internationally adopted and I would fear that it could lead to a dangerous or exploitive situation. Some doors are best left shut. Each adoption situation is vastly different.
Busman wrote a beautiful post that captures my feelings perfectly. I really had no interest in maintaining an open relationship with a family, especially through the foster system or through an open adoption but especially the foster system. As Sheena stated, why the heck would anyone in their sane mind want to maintain an open relationship with a parent who abused their child to the point of being in a body cast? Insanity in my opinion. I'm glad that we chose the international adoption route. This worked for our family. Like others, we initially explored the US foster system. Experiences of friends and acquaintances made me realize that other paths to adoption would be a better fit.
Sheena, we are going to have to agree to disagree. Again, I understand where you are coming from but I also know what is going on from the other side (I'm involved in social work). Steps have been taken to sever biological parents rights faster when their behavior is criminal or they are simply not interested in being parents - I have seen it happen. I know of two cases personally where the children were adopted by their foster parents - their only foster parents - in less than two years and both children had been placed with them as infants. It happens.
Every state's laws are different as far as what steps must be taken to remove a child from the home and to terminate rights. I don't know what the laws are where you live. I do know, however, that there are laws the social workers must obey, and contact with the bio family is encouraged even after termination. Maybe mom was terrible, but grandma loved her grandchildren with all her heart. These children shouldn't have to lose everything because their parents made terrible choices.
You and I have different ideas about adoption - I don't think adoption should wipe out the bio family and pretend as though they never existed. That is damaging to the adopted child, whether that child was adopted as an infant from another country or a 7 year old from one city over. Adopted kids have rights too, and their right to know their family needs to be respected.
You're in social work? Well my experience as a child coming from one of these less than stellar families, shall we call them, trumps social worker experience.
The very LAST THING I needed was a visit from the piles of trash who did what they did, over and over and over and over again because the social workers wanted to keep the family together, after I finally got free of them and got adopted. THAT'S THE LAST FRICKEN THING I NEEDED OR WANTED.
I was old enough to know them. I was four. I knew them, I knew their names, I knew what they did. People try to pretend that kids don't have memories before the age of 4...baloney. I remember very early incidents.
It doesn't matter if "grandma loved her children", when you adopt, especially from situations that are bad, you do NOT subject that child to anyone in that family again. When they are older, they can then seek them out, but do NOT screw them up any more than they are by making them stay in contact with any member of the family they were from.
False, false, false. Look, I agree that in many, many cases biological parents are given WAY too many chances and the children suffer at the hands of the system. I've also seen SO many wonderful, beautiful families formed through foster care. And every single one was younger than 5 at placement. I don't know where you live but I promise you in Hawaii, Colorado, Ohio and Maryland your statements are not true. I'm sorry you've had bad experiences. There is no doubt the U.S. is in desperate need of having the entire foster care system overhauled. But please don't scare away potential foster/adoptive parents with such sweeping generalizations. The children cannot afford it.
^^THIS!!!
I was a licensed foster parent in NM and am considering attaining my license here in CO.
Yes, there are many horrible, heartbreaking stories and it is extremely hard to understand the attempts at reunification in many cases.
But, and it is a very big but, I met many families that adopted through foster care. The children were all ages - infants through teens.
Yes, there were challenges but the overwhelming number of these cases were very positive and uplifting.
Many of the foster parents that I met had been fostered themselves and because they had been taken in and loved by a foster family were eager to give back to other kids in similar situations.
No, fostering is not for everyone, but, people do a great disservice to the kids when posting such negative accounts.
You're in social work? Well my experience as a child coming from one of these less than stellar families, shall we call them, trumps social worker experience.
The very LAST THING I needed was a visit from the piles of trash who did what they did, over and over and over and over again because the social workers wanted to keep the family together, after I finally got free of them and got adopted. THAT'S THE LAST FRICKEN THING I NEEDED OR WANTED.
I was old enough to know them. I was four. I knew them, I knew their names, I knew what they did. People try to pretend that kids don't have memories before the age of 4...baloney. I remember very early incidents.
It doesn't matter if "grandma loved her children", when you adopt, especially from situations that are bad, you do NOT subject that child to anyone in that family again. When they are older, they can then seek them out, but do NOT screw them up any more than they are by making them stay in contact with any member of the family they were from.
Social workers have a LOT to learn.
Thank you for posting, Three Wolves In Snow. So well stated.
You are a good person, and I am sorry, really sorry that these things happened to you.
The current system values the biological parents over anyone. It is not "child centered". Not in the least. It seems to regard children as chattel - property of their parents. This is wrong.
What I understood Sheena12 to say was that children were not available until age 10. That is pretty much the standard UNLESS you are willing to fost/adopt and in that case, you'll see the child possibly go back and forth to a birth parent or the child may return to the birth parent or other family member.
I don't actually remember reading anything bad about foster care in this thread but there are a lot of horror stories that make the news. I have known people that were in the foster care system. I have also inquired about children that had been placed in "permanent foster care" because the foster parents did not want to give up the child but also did not want to adopt them and in both cases, these were children with Down syndrome. "Permanent" foster care equals "I don't want the checks to stop." And, actually they probably would have qualified for subsidies but then, they would have a child with Down syndrome versus a foster with Down syndrome. I thought this was so wrong. We were proven parents of a child with Down syndrome and had an approved homestudy.
One more: We adopted through a facilitator for babies and children with Down syndrome after messing around with the state for 3 years, finding out that our home study was never sent to Topeka but had just been sitting in a file cabinet so we would never have gotten any referrals. The private agency learned of a baby that they were not able to take in at the time with Down syndrome, a little baby boy, they called us and asked if we would be ready for another and if so, they would go to court in Missouri and ask if they could take custody of the baby as they had a family, us. The state refused and the baby went into foster care.
Gosh, we were lied to about children being placed and then see them in the newspaper or on the TV as still waiting for a home some months later. We were told by our 1st state social worker when we asked about a little deaf and blind 5 year boy that since our older child was a bright, she just couldn't see us having a child with special needs. Funny, I saw in the library after we adopted our son with Down syndrome. We did just fine and continue to do so.
SO MANY good people try to adopt and get nothing but shrugged off. It is sad too because the children never realize that people are asking about them, they saw them on TV or in the newspaper and thought it would be great to add that child to their family. The children never know that people do want to adopt them but "stuff" gets in the way.
Last edited by AnywhereElse; 07-13-2015 at 04:45 PM..
I work in the foster care and have for several years. In our state, the only children that are adoptable that you can actually pick, are ones that are over five and have behavioral issues, or are part of sibling group (where one sibling has behavioral issues) or a teen or are special needs. The ones without behavioral issues or that are under five are adopted by the foster parents. Foster parents get first pick at the children should they become adoptable. Of course they probably have fostered numerous times before they get a keeper. Sometimes a baby Moses comes up where the the baby is dropped off at a fire station etc... very rare though. And the number of people submitting on that baby is huge. So you can foster to adopt but it isn't fast nor easy.
That's the way it is here in this state.
You're in social work? Well my experience as a child coming from one of these less than stellar families, shall we call them, trumps social worker experience.
The very LAST THING I needed was a visit from the piles of trash who did what they did, over and over and over and over again because the social workers wanted to keep the family together, after I finally got free of them and got adopted. THAT'S THE LAST FRICKEN THING I NEEDED OR WANTED.
I was old enough to know them. I was four. I knew them, I knew their names, I knew what they did. People try to pretend that kids don't have memories before the age of 4...baloney. I remember very early incidents.
It doesn't matter if "grandma loved her children", when you adopt, especially from situations that are bad, you do NOT subject that child to anyone in that family again. When they are older, they can then seek them out, but do NOT screw them up any more than they are by making them stay in contact with any member of the family they were from.
Social workers have a LOT to learn.
TWIS, I'm sorry you had a bad experience, but do you really think social work and the foster system is exactly the same as it was when you went through it? How many years, how many decades ago was that?
Social workers do have a lot to learn, which is why the best of them are doing - and have been doing - the best they can to change the system from within. The foster system has changed a lot in just the last ten years, because those who work in social services are still learning.
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