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Not a bad thought, that.
But here's an interesting slant to it: Why not work hard on diet, exercise and finances so that when you're 90 you can still go?! To me, there is something pitiful about an 80 year-old who has destroyed himself and can no longer enjoy his life. So I have worked to prevent it. I'm 78 and not much interested in travel. My sister, who is 81, feels differently about travel and will leave for Turkey in a few weeks.
That's kind of an odd take, especially when "living well" doesn't guarantee anything. My father took good care of himself, and developed Alzheimer's within 2 years of retiring. My mother has also been fairly good to her body, and is now fighting stage 4 colon cancer at age 74 (with a 2-5 year prognosis). So neither of them are/were victims of unhealthy lifestyles, considering they both ate fairly healthy and never smoked/rarely drank alcohol. And my mother also faced unexpected financial issues in middle age, following divorce and other stuff. So it's a good thing they both had the opportunities to travel extensively in their younger years, because genetics + fate would have kept them from doing it later in life.
Besides, how "spry" can a 90 year-old really be?? I don't care how well you take care of yourself, very few 90 year-olds are physically capable of strenuous activities; they can sit on the deck of a cruise ship, or a tour bus, but won't be able to do much beyond that. Generally speaking. So yeah, I'd rather not take my chances by waiting. And not everyone cares to spend their lives dieting and exercising, either. To quote John Steinbeck "I've lifted, pulled, chopped, climbed, made love with joy and taken my hangovers as a consequence, not as a punishment. I did not want to surrender fierceness for a small gain in yardage."
Some of my vacation trips were 4 or 8 hour drive to the destination. Our honeymoon was an 8 hour drive to San Antonio in February. We saved hundreds of dollars by not flying
Most of my vacations involve driving 4-8 hours... typically I only consider flying if driving would take longer than that. But I visit my family in Las Vegas regularly, and that's a good 8-9 hours depending on how long/often I stop on the way. One time recently I decided to fly there instead (since I had less time to spend), and it ended up taking almost as long. It's a ~50-minute drive from my house to the airport/parking, plus you have to get there early for check-in & security, then getting off the plane, renting a car, etc. It was about 6 hours by the time all was said and done. So I only saved maybe 2 hours of time, spent more money, and didn't get to have my car with me? Nah.
That's kind of an odd take, especially when "living well" doesn't guarantee anything. My father took good care of himself, and developed Alzheimer's within 2 years of retiring. My mother has also been fairly good to her body, and is now fighting stage 4 colon cancer at age 74 (with a 2-5 year prognosis). So neither of them are/were victims of unhealthy lifestyles, considering they both ate fairly healthy and never smoked/rarely drank alcohol. And my mother also faced unexpected financial issues in middle age, following divorce and other stuff. So it's a good thing they both had the opportunities to travel extensively in their younger years, because genetics + fate would have kept them from doing it later in life.
Besides, how "spry" can a 90 year-old really be?? I don't care how well you take care of yourself, very few 90 year-olds are physically capable of strenuous activities; they can sit on the deck of a cruise ship, or a tour bus, but won't be able to do much beyond that. Generally speaking. So yeah, I'd rather not take my chances by waiting. And not everyone cares to spend their lives dieting and exercising, either. To quote John Steinbeck "I've lifted, pulled, chopped, climbed, made love with joy and taken my hangovers as a consequence, not as a punishment. I did not want to surrender fierceness for a small gain in yardage."..
There is nothing "odd" about urging others to take care of themselves. In fact, it is odd how few of us do take care of our health and finances.
90 year-olds: You become exceptional by doing things other people won't do, not by doing what everyone else does. Healthy, vibrant 90 year-old people are those who worked at it. There are no healthy vibrant 90 year-olds who did not work at it. You want guarantees in life?.. I'll give you one. You live your life like John Steinbeck - drinking and smoking all his life - and you, too will die at 66.
So how spry can a 90 year-old be?...... As spry as Jack LaLanne at his 90th birthday party. Or Kirk Douglas, who danced at his 100th.
The people you meet while traveling often bring back good memories.
I've had interesting discussions even in restaurants, convenience stores and underground trains with people I struck up conversations with.
Still, there are certain places - like Alaska or New Zealand - that are so superlative in my mind that I don't want to suddenly wake up one day when I'm 90 years old and regret that I never got to see them when I was younger and in much better health.
In the 80s my also American friend and I got into a conversation with this really old guy on a train platform in Dortmund. Between his somewhat rusty English and our rusty German. We managed to communicate. He was a tailor, and it turned out he had lived in Chicago for a period and had been Al Copone's tailor!
Some of my vacation trips were 4 or 8 hour drive to the destination. Our honeymoon was an 8 hour drive to San Antonio in February. We saved hundreds of dollars by not flying
If ONLY we could not fly! I'd give anything to drive from here (Ecuador) to CA. I don't care how long it takes. But there's that pesky Darien Gap in the way....
Some people aren't interested in nor planning on retiring, in the traditional sense. "Live for today."
I admit to never giving retirement a single thought in my younger working years. Never crossed my mind. I didn't even know what SS actually was, until later life.
I was a "live for today" person, so I get that mind-set. Had plenty of fun, no regrets, but less $$$ in retirement, lol. It's a trade-off, like everything else in life.
There is nothing "odd" about urging others to take care of themselves. In fact, it is odd how few of us do take care of our health and finances.
That's not at ALL what I'm saying lol. I am saying that one shouldn't count on those things giving them longevity and good health... it doesn't hurt to try, if that's how you want to live, but putting off travel (or anything you want to do) because "I'll be healthy in my 90s" is a risky plan. That's what I mean.
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90 year-olds: You become exceptional by doing things other people won't do, not by doing what everyone else does. Healthy, vibrant 90 year-old people are those who worked at it. There are no healthy vibrant 90 year-olds who did not work at it.
That is simply not true. Since you're giving rare examples below of the opposite, I'm sure we all know/knew that old person who "drank and smoked 'til they were 95." My grandmother, while not a smoker or drinker, hardly "worked at it" - or anything, really. Just lived a fairly average life of good hearty Polish-Jewish foods and minimal exercise. She lived to 97, and was fairly spry until the last handful of years. Sometimes all you've got on your side (or against you) is genetics, and that's a fact.
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You want guarantees in life?.. I'll give you one. You live your life like John Steinbeck - drinking and smoking all his life - and you, too will die at 66.
So be it. I bet he lived more in those 66 years than most do in 80+!
And no, I don't live like Steinbeck; in fact within the last few years I've quit smoking, and lost a significant amount of weight. And I've never been a drinker. But if someone chooses to live hard, that's a valid choice too... not everyone wants to live 100 years, and most of the fun stuff is when you're young anyway. My point is to live like every day is your last, not to wait until later because you're too busy saving money and eating kale.
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So how spry can a 90 year-old be?...... As spry as Jack LaLanne at his 90th birthday party. Or Kirk Douglas, who danced at his 100th.
Those are exceptions - hence why I said very FEW 90 year-olds are that spry. They were among the few. But if you're willing to gamble on being one of those extreme exceptions, more power to you. I'd rather assume I won't be one of them (especially given my family history), and have wonderful experiences NOW. While I know I still can. I've just known too many people who spent their lives planning for later, only to end up not having a "later."
That hit a nerve. If America is becoming so cookie cutter that it's the same everywhere, then maybe people really NEED to escape the dreariness of it all. People (me too) complain that shopping malls have all the same stores no matter where you go, and that suburbia all looks the same everywhere, with the usual strip malls with the usual mix of stores, and the same fast food "nutrition." Critic James Kunstler spoke about this, in his unique and honest style, in his book "The Geography of Nowhere" which he characterizes as "...the greatest misallocation of resources in the history of the world. America is still building more of this crap, still hostage to the deadly paradigm that is turning the American landscape into a pathetic cartoon." . . . .
Good point. Generica comes from cost minimization and space maximization. It takes more time and money to be unique and thought out. It's clear 1990s America didn't value this uniqueness much, 2023 America does more, local and unique are on the upswing, but there's still lots of Chick Fil As. But it kinda goes back to my point, people are spending money on the jet or the truck and RV - their weekend experience rather than prioritizing their weekday day to day experience... More important than experiencing some amazing things is living in a place where you routinely experience some things you like.
I've never really lived in the middle of Generica, and when I was the closest to it, I made a conscious effort and got out of there, and found a place that had a lot of things nearby that matched what I liked to do. Here in Taos, it feels like every weekend is a vacation, and it's a lot more relaxing cause I don't have to plan the weekend out in advance, I just kinda know the gist of what usually goes on and figure out the day before and end up in good activities.
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Originally Posted by ncole1
Partially agreed - some people are missing out on things closer to home. That said, the issue you mention with risk taking is a result of being too time-constrained on your trip, not with travel itself.
Extremely frequent long-distance moving is nearly indistinguishable from extended travel.
Yes, some people have gone way overboard with travel, and with the social media showoffs. I agree completely. I would, however, like to see a reference for your 8-10% figure, that seems a bit high.
Yep - exactly. If you're gonna do something long distance, take the time to do it correctly and really soak it in rather than jump back and forth because there's time constraints. Like why go to South America if you don't have the 2 weeks you need to do it the right way.
Here's the link where I saw that. https://www.dw.com/en/how-bad-for-th...20destination. "According to the World Travel & Tourism Council, 8-10% of global CO2 emissions are caused by the travel and tourism sector. The majority of such emissions are caused by travel to and from a destination."
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Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident
I see your points, but my counter arguments point-by-point are:
1) Perhaps, but even sticking to the "best of" lists can be rewarding for many; indeed, they're the "best of" for a reason. I prefer to stick to where the locals are eating myself, but will also try some of the "best of" dining establishments and tourist attractions all of the same.
2) The way I look at it, the world is big (heck, the US is big). Some people get plenty of satisfaction from visiting the same place over and over again, or just by relaxing at home. Others get a thrill of traveling to experience other countries/cultures/etc. I can't knock anyone for either approach as what scratches that itch may be different and unique for every person.
3) I think that all depends. Even in places like Maui (heck, you have enough locals screaming the same on Oahu, which is where I live) where a small but vocal contingent (to include the governor at one point) are anti-tourist, they simply cannot survive without tourists as tourism IS the local economy. And now local businesses are begging for tourists to return to Maui: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maui-fi...awaii-tourism/
Some people tend to not think of the second and third order impacts of these decisions, which is something that I see far too often in Hawaii. In Maui's case, the substantial drop in tourism threatens to put tons of locals out of work at a time where they most need the work.
Consider this from the link I posted above:
4) I can appreciate your position and see how it's particularly relevant considering the subject of debate being Millennials here, who (together with younger generations) are perhaps most vocal about environmental issues. But then you have to consider the opposite view where some Millennials are more in favor of being judicious about emissions (as opposed to working to completely limit unnecessary emissions), which means spreading the load (i.e. engaging in "mass" transit travel whether by air, train, etc.). Thus, traveling commercials on a large jetliner is more palatable than traveling in a private jet with fewer people to "spread" emissions across.
That said, I don't knock people who feel as you do. I've always said if people think leisure travel and the such are unnecessary, then don't travel I and many others happen to think differently.
Best of things are inspiring, beautiful, and amazing, but they are more pleasurable than eye opening. The eye opening things sometimes aren't pleasurable...
I think planning to go to places 2-3 times is a sweet spot. You can see what changed from what you remember, you can jog those old memories and know the things you liked to do, but still have a pretty novel experience without feeling samesy.
People know that tourism is needed, but it brings up weird feelings. Just last night someone arsoned a Starbucks that was being built here in Taos, and there was a lot of undercurrent online about corporations sucking out the local spirit, Texans taking over, locals shops being threatened... This is repulsive behavior, but it indicates that when tourism is too dominate, people feel like they don't own their town. In every way a permanent remote worker or retiree is better than a tourist.
One thing I wanted to mention, just because I'm posturing this position that people spend too much time travelling does not mean I think that people spend too much time on experiences. What I'm saying is that people should be spending more time doing, less time getting somewhere. Spend more time out on the trail, less time driving to some new trail. Time where your butt is in a seat is not experiencing fully. I just took a 3 day trip over to Chama NM, but because it was less than 2 hrs away, I could get a lot in on the trip, didn't have to prep much, and had sunday open to go to contact dance! If I went to Durango, the scenery would have been more WOW, but I wouldn't have done as much cause it's farther away(and it would have been more crowded). It's not like I'm pining for the life where everyone just sits and waits for the grass to grow so they can get out on the mower again, those people are every bit as unbalanced lol.
And on the age note, it's not even waiting for retirement. The average 46 year old couple still has good opportunities to travel. They've been at their job long enough to get better PTO, parents / siblings can take care of the kids while they are gone for 2 weeks. The only time when it seems lousy to travel is the age when kids under 4. Outside of that, most of life seems to offer good opportunities. Especially now with at least some remote flexibility, people can make the out of office thing work to get the time they need to do longer distance trips right. We can now travel all through our careers instead of at the beginning or after they end.
Good point. Generica comes from cost minimization and space maximization. It takes more time and money to be unique and thought out. It's clear 1990s America didn't value this uniqueness much, 2023 America does more, local and unique are on the upswing, but there's still lots of Chick Fil As.
Last year I had to visit Tallahassee FL for a friend's daughter's graduation, and had a full day on my own to kill beforehand - so I just drove randomly to Alabama and Georgia, since I had never technically been to either. Ended up in a town called Cottonwood (AL), then hit up the closest GA towns on my way back. When someone asked what I saw out there, my response was "a lot of churches and Dollar Stores." lol
Literally, though. That's basically all you see! But I actually had a great time, especially walking around Cottonwood and seeing what life is like in a small southern town. Hardly a tourism hotspot, so it was a very unique experience. It's just all the stuff in between that became quite repetitive and "Generica" in nature. It was one of my more memorable trips, however, and I've been all over the world.
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I and many others happen to think differently.