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You have yourself quite an intelligent son, Sir fisheye. Yes, a very common moth, I wonder if that has anything to do with it as well?
Thank you for the link.
Thank you! He did some post-doc work many years ago with moths.
I'm just a retired 30 year Teamster truck driver that also spent about 14 years working as a grunt in the pharmaceutical industry. But I have watched as another new flu production building is nearing completion. I know that they are spending a fortune; not to mention the $600 million they paid for the company that will incorporate some of it's technology into this building. It was originally suppose to be the old egg production facility until the Protein Science acquisition. Then the plan was to incorporate the new technology into this building - I have no idea how that is going?
There are high stakes in the new vaccine. If for some reason that 'one shot works for all'/'one shot will last many years' vaccine makes it to market sooner than they think; then many millions could be lost. Of course the building/s can be refurbished with new equipment; but nothing is cheap and everything needs validation and licensing.
Of course GSX is also in the competition as well as other big players. There is a lot of money at stake and the health of a Nation. Right now it takes a good six months to get the vaccine to market. The CDC does a pretty good job of guess work at predicting the next season flu - but they are not perfect and they have made mistakes. This new technology could shave months off the production time. That way it might be possibly to get vaccine to the public as viruses mutate. It could be possible to save millions if we ever had another 1918 pandemic. We have estimated, that world wide, between 20 to as many as 50 million people died in that pandemic in 1918.
You are probably correct for the 'one shot for all strains' vaccination. As far as other new technologies; they have been approved. GSX had licensing for several years but, from what I understand; they have production problems. The Protein Sciences research has already been licensed as I understand and it will be incorporated in Sanofi's new flu building finishing construction. I admit that it is very complicated process; especially with a totally new product. I assume and I might be wrong; that much of the equipment will be custom built for the process. That equipment will have to be validated and the building will have to be licensed by the FDA - not an easy task.
I am just looking at the money that is already committed and that is staggering. Sanofi paid $600 million for the Protein Sciences company and Sanofi's new production facility, I am guessing, could cost considerably more than that. I would say that the cost will easily exceed $1 billion. GSX with government funding laid out about $600 million for their NC cell membrane plant and they have had a hard time getting their product to market. You do not spend money like this without high (very high) expectations of a promising future.
If they are spending this much, prepare for mandatory vaccinations for the whole country, no matter what age or health status.
If they are spending that much, they WILL profit off it, and vaccines are the high money ticket. Get lobbyists, who outnumber congressman like 3-1, biggest lobby in the country, to pressure for mandatory vaccination. Add in the inability to openly sue a pharma manufacturer in state or federal court, and vaccines are the surest drug to sell. No liability whatsoever. Total profit. Captive citizens who can't say no.
Costs more than $1 billion??? Mandatory coming down the pike. Bookmark this post and tell me I'm wrong once it's rubberstamped through the FDA. And I'm deadly serious about that.
If they are spending this much, prepare for mandatory vaccinations for the whole country, no matter what age or health status.
If they are spending that much, they WILL profit off it, and vaccines are the high money ticket. Get lobbyists, who outnumber congressman like 3-1, biggest lobby in the country, to pressure for mandatory vaccination. Add in the inability to openly sue a pharma manufacturer in state or federal court, and vaccines are the surest drug to sell. No liability whatsoever. Total profit. Captive citizens who can't say no.
Costs more than $1 billion??? Mandatory coming down the pike. Bookmark this post and tell me I'm wrong once it's rubberstamped through the FDA. And I'm deadly serious about that.
There is one other aspect of spending this amount of money; the race to be 'first to market'. Every year the pharmaceutical giants race to be first to market. The doctors and hospitals will order vaccine from multiple sources. If you have production problems or the FDA does not release your vaccine another company can beat you to fill the orders and your orders get canceled. That does not mean that your vaccine will not be used; but you have to scramble to find new markets. The clock is also ticking because your vaccine has a limited 'shelf life'. On one occasion I had disposed of $43 million dollars worth of serum because it could not get to market before the expiration date. The companies always have to error on the side of safety - regardless of cost. It is not all profit.
I was serious about that $1 billion. The final figure will be many, many, millions over the $1 billion and that is just the investment for the one company. GSX spent $600 million just for the one cell membrane facility in NC. As far as lobbyist; our government has a vested interest in the success of these programs. Flu could be weaponized: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC539539/. I know of one country that would love to weaponize flu or any other disease if they could get away with it. Even without any nefarious country planning our downfall; flu kills about 36,000 people each year in the US. That is with having the vaccine available; think of the possibilities if there was no available vaccine. Right now we are hearing of schools closing because of the flu and hospitals that are turning patients away because they are full.
It does look as if this will all change if the Georgia State research ever makes it to market. My feeling is that it will take a good ten to fifteen years (if everything goes as planned). I have no idea how complicated any production of a product like that would be? If that potential new vaccine would hit the market then we might be on the path to eliminate most flu?
Back in the 1960's I helped make smallpox vaccinations. We basically worked ourselves out of a job. The last reported case of smallpox was in Somalia in October of 2017: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00049694.htm. Smallpox is a terrible way to die - just Google 'pictures of smallpox'. The company's goal will always be to eliminate a disease if possible - even if it puts them out of work. Of course there will always be another challenge.
If they are spending this much, prepare for mandatory vaccinations for the whole country, no matter what age or health status.
If they are spending that much, they WILL profit off it, and vaccines are the high money ticket. Get lobbyists, who outnumber congressman like 3-1, biggest lobby in the country, to pressure for mandatory vaccination. Add in the inability to openly sue a pharma manufacturer in state or federal court, and vaccines are the surest drug to sell. No liability whatsoever. Total profit. Captive citizens who can't say no.
Costs more than $1 billion??? Mandatory coming down the pike. Bookmark this post and tell me I'm wrong once it's rubberstamped through the FDA. And I'm deadly serious about that.
They will mandate it for children's school admission. Maybe Newborns? Require boosters throughout childhood? Extremely difficult to mandate it for adults. Just look at all the trouble they are having requiring Nurses and Pregnant Women to get their flu shots. Think the general public will comply without a fight?
Fear sells. That is why you cannot turn on the TV today without hearing the number of flu cases, and deaths. The general public hasn't been sold, yet, on the fear factor of the flu as it has with deadly measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc.
Yes, profits. I used to work in the Corporate Offices (Finance) of a major Pharm. If a new "product" (called that) will not be profitable, there will be no rush to invent and market it. Where is our Zika vaccine? Too small of a targeted consumer (pregnant women) to be very profitable. Unless, of course, the vaccine will give lifetime immunity and they mandate it for children.
They will mandate it for children's school admission. Maybe Newborns? Require boosters throughout childhood? Extremely difficult to mandate it for adults. Just look at all the trouble they are having requiring Nurses and Pregnant Women to get their flu shots. Think the general public will comply without a fight?
Fear sells. That is why you cannot turn on the TV today without hearing the number of flu cases, and deaths. The general public hasn't been sold, yet, on the fear factor of the flu as it has with deadly measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc.
Yes, profits. I used to work in the Corporate Offices (Finance) of a major Pharm. If a new "product" (called that) will not be profitable, there will be no rush to invent and market it. Where is our Zika vaccine? Too small of a targeted consumer (pregnant women) to be very profitable. Unless, of course, the vaccine will give lifetime immunity and they mandate it for children.
Many times these vaccines are just a gamble. Sometimes even trials do not give all the answers: https://www.chemistryworld.com/news/...008436.article. The public screams to speed up the process because of the suffering and deaths; but speed to market does not guarantee a winner.
I also hope that somebody is working on a Zilka vaccine. I would like to see them also turn their attention to the West Nile virus as well as Lyme disease. Possibly, as these diseases spread or technology improves, we will see companies offer a treatment or vaccine?
As far as mandating any vaccine; it is extremely difficult. There is the government hotline for reporting any negative reaction to any drug: https://www.fda.gov/Safety/MedWatch/.../ucm053074.htm. Just look at how many people think they got the flu from flu vaccines. In many of those cases they were exposed to the flu before they actually received the vaccination. In some cases they were vaccinated against a strain that was not covered by the immunization or they caught the flu before the necessary two weeks people needed to build their immunities. It doesn't make any difference; people will still report any 'problems' as an adverse reaction.
Since you worked in the corporate offices; you know that all of this cost money and lots of it. Investigations are very expensive; they can even put corporations out of business. Or they can lead to medicines being withheld from the public. Of course they are a necessary part of the equation. We need medicines we can count on that are 'safe'.
They will mandate it for children's school admission. Maybe Newborns? Require boosters throughout childhood? Extremely difficult to mandate it for adults. Just look at all the trouble they are having requiring Nurses and Pregnant Women to get their flu shots. Think the general public will comply without a fight?
Fear sells. That is why you cannot turn on the TV today without hearing the number of flu cases, and deaths. The general public hasn't been sold, yet, on the fear factor of the flu as it has with deadly measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc.
Yes, profits. I used to work in the Corporate Offices (Finance) of a major Pharm. If a new "product" (called that) will not be profitable, there will be no rush to invent and market it. Where is our Zika vaccine? Too small of a targeted consumer (pregnant women) to be very profitable. Unless, of course, the vaccine will give lifetime immunity and they mandate it for children.
There is an adult immunization schedule that is already in the works, and has been for years. Not a lot of people are aware of it, but it's a nice document that details how to convince the public that all adults need vaccines and when they should get them, and lays out the whole schedule of shots.
If they are spending $1 billion, per the other poster's estimate, it will be mandatory. It has to be to get their money back. And there will be boosters, etc., to ensure continued $$$$. Maybe they find it's only effective for 5 years, so need an extra one every 5 years. Maybe hey here's a NEW strain this year, so get another vaccine shot to cover that. $$$$$
Nurses are being fired for not getting the vaccines. My neighbor has a fight every single year about it with her employer and it is getting harder and harder to say no. I know she was fighting with them this year about it and I don;t know what ultimately happened. I'll have to ask her.
And any pregnant woman who gets a shot is an idiot, IMO. That is a developing baby, and to subject it to the chemicals, preservatives and DNA of other animals while DEVELOPING is a criminal act. They used to say no no no to shots for pregnant women and now *all of a sudden* shots are *healthy* and *good for the baby*? Not buying it. Glad others aren't either.
Yep. Fear sells to an uninformed and emotional public.
We have to keep our focus on flu vaccine innovation. It is an important subject and the choices of new vaccines will be here shortly - if nothing goes wrong. So the more informed you are; the greater the odds that you will make the right choice when selecting these new vaccines for yourself and your family.
We have to keep our focus on flu vaccine innovation. It is an important subject and the choices of new vaccines will be here shortly - if nothing goes wrong. So the more informed you are; the greater the odds that you will make the right choice when selecting these new vaccines for yourself and your family.
And if people want to get them? Fine.
If people DON't want to get them? Fine.
Just don't make them mandatory. Ever. That's the issue moving forward. And it happens in this fashion: new vaccine, ain't it great? People get it voluntarily. Once the voluntary rush starts to peter out, then it becomes mandatory for schools, it's the main source of income for the manufacturers, the public school vaccination policies. Then it moves into workplaces, which we are seeing in the health industry. Then it will eventually move to the general population.
Drip, drip drip. Every thing is voluntary until people stop volunteering and then it becomes mandatory.
And if a company is going to spend $1 billion? It will be mandatory for schools and healthcare workers and then I predict it will gradually move to the general population. Take a look at the "predicted" adult vaccine schedule. It's a public doc and spells it out very clearly how to move the vaccine industry into the adult patient population, even though we've never had an adult vaccine schedule.
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