Covenants, Restrictions, and By-Laws…Oh, My! (Madison, Troy: sales, lawyers, houses)

[DvlsAdvc8]

I don't know anything about that case, I'm just stating that my experience in VA wasn't much different from AL (except that the C&R is more upfront). I'm just speaking to the totalitarianism that Diffy sees here. Developers very often had total control in VA as well until build out. As with many of the C&Rs here, they have the option of letting the association do certain things, but they don't have to - and they can appoint and remove people from say architectural committees and what not.

As for selling amenities, when I was reading C&Rs when we were looking for a house, most stated that common property and amenities in the declarant's care will be passed to the association once the provisions for the end of the declarants rights were met.

We read our C&R months before closing. The builder had them posted on their website, it took a little digging to find, but they were there - and I can understand why they put them where they did, even though it was buried a little.

Even when it comes to unilaterally changing the C&R, the developer usually has some constraints. In ours, there is a section that specifies the conditions under which the developer may amend the C&R. These are things like changes to comply with law, insurance, lender requirements etc.

In our community, the C&R states that the developer's rights end once they have sold all lots (construction and sale period) - all common ground, responsibilities and what not are conveyed to the association.

This is the same as it was when we lived in a new house in VA... but the developer allowed the association to proceed and manage things, they were pretty hands off, but they could have done everything themselves if they wanted to.

[ionlife]

We also found the original HOA docs on our developer's website, and it read pretty much like yours' Dvlsadvc8 here, but there was a posting AFTER the fact of the bylaws. And we weren't afforded the same courtesies you were afforded. If your development is built out, then you're lucky, because ours is not. I think these changes and intricacies were added to the basic docs in the past year, year and half, when builders realized the brac wouldn't save them from overextending themselves.

All common property etc. will be passed on to our association once we're built out, but it will be difficult to build out in this time, and at our price point. We're a hair under some more expensive subs, but the truth is that most people coming here won't be buying at our price point. They'll be able to afford in the 200 to 300 range.

Also, we have two lots in our subdivision that will be next to impossible to sell. One is super small and next to a creek. The other is in a washout area, also small. It would take a salesman with the gifts of great genius and fast talking combined with an blind buyer with little sense to move those lots.

So we're stuck. For 15 years. 2021 seems like its a long way away.

In VA, we took over ownership of the association when the subdivision was 2/3rd built out. The developer(s)--there were two builders--were more than happy to turn over the administration to us.

Such is not the case here.

And why should WE have to DIG for buried documents on a website? And PAY to print them out (ink and paper)--why doesn't the realtor or the developer do that for the buyer here?

[ionlife]

And our declarant has the right to VETO anything--there are no constraints.

[Diffy Q]

And therein lies the rub. You are in effect signing your rights away as a homeowner. Granted, the subdivision may be turned over in time with no harm done, but it is a legal document giving the Declarant rights that he really has no business having past those concerning the mainenance of the property values. Why would he want to stop milking the proverbial cash cow? Out of the goodness of his heart? Not in this economy. I heard one builder said as much to the homeowners in one of his subdivisions. It was his right in this economy to do what he needed to do to make money. Give me a break. I hear the fast food places down there are hiring.

[ionlife]

Our developer must really need to sell houses right now if he's willing to prostitute our amenities to do it. Too bad he doesn't use his other super priced development to sell more of his smaller, cheaper homes. But then he'd lose potential buyers at the higher price point if they knew they weren't getting exclusive rights to their even smaller pool and clubhouse.

As I said, till this is resolved and we let as many people know where/how to look for this info about any of the new developments, I recommend buying in established communities.

[Toymeister]

It also possible to move in a sub w/o a HOA but self regulates (peer pressure) itself. Yes there are such areas. Some are simple oddites where it was intended that a HOA and club house be set up but it was later struck down by our justice system.

Regardless, if it is an established neighborhood its unlikely that your street mates will start placing prefab storage sheds in the back yard or chain link fences up in place of a wooden one. No you won't get the community pool but you can save 1,000 a year in fees and quite possibly some pink eye (uck)

[ionlife]

Originally Posted by Toymeister

It also possible to move in a sub w/o a HOA but self regulates (peer pressure) itself. Yes there are such areas. Some are simple oddites where it was intended that a HOA and club house be set up but it was later struck down by our justice system.

Regardless, if it is an established neighborhood its unlikely that your street mates will start placing prefab storage sheds in the back yard or chain link fences up in place of a wooden one. No you won't get the community pool but you can save 1,000 a year in fees and quite possibly some pink eye (uck)

That's why we bought a home with an HOA C&R because we wanted to have a certain architectural standard maintained for resale purposes. However, the end result is protecting the declarant's rights more than ours. We didn't have an HOA in our first subdivision 18 years ago, but times were quite different then--and we managed to take care of our properties and help those who had husbands traveling etc with mowing lawns etc. We all cared.

I think one can find that here, but there is a greater chance that due to both homeowners working and cultural differences that the basic ideas of maintaining a lovely home environment might not be upheld. And that can cause lower values when trying to resell. We know we'll be moving again. We can't afford to lose money.

But I think the declarant has already begun undervaluing our area and adding more families from developments with much lower price points isn't going to help.

Thankfully, I think I have at least 8 more years to recuperate from this debacle and break even (I hope--)

[autobahn]

Another thing that sucks is while the developer is in control, all the common area, clubhouse and pool are property taxed at a commercial rate. When the HOA finally takes over, they can request a reassessment by the county tax assessor and that is not effective until the following year. In our HOA, we dropped our taxes from $6000 to $500 when we took over for about 20 acres of common area, pool and clubhouse. Meanwhile, when the taxes are high, the residents are wasting their HOA dues on the taxes and not on other capital improvements (or rainy day escrow) to the neighborhood.

[ionlife]

Originally Posted by autobahn

Another thing that sucks is while the developer is in control, all the common area, clubhouse and pool are property taxed at a commercial rate. When the HOA finally takes over, they can request a reassessment by the county tax assessor and that is not effective until the following year. In our HOA, we dropped our taxes from $6000 to $500 when we took over for about 20 acres of common area, pool and clubhouse. Meanwhile, when the taxes are high, the residents are wasting their HOA dues on the taxes and not on other capital improvements (or rainy day escrow) to the neighborhood.

Wow, that's another issue I never even knew existed... thanks for pointing that out to me. I think we may need to take a short term hit for a long term gain... literally. But I am not on the board... they have their work cut out for them!

[autobahn]

Wow!

Builder's woes stir property concerns - al.com