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Thus, one's appearance and skin color don't necessarily have much correlation when it comes to one's treatment in Hawai'i.
Actually, I just gave 2 examples of how it does.
Your appearance has an impact on how you are perceived anywhere--not just Hawaii--besides "cues", people wear uniforms whether it's a hippie uniform, a jock uniform, a nerd uniform--whatever
Those particular ways we all have of expressing ourselves and definining who we are to the outside world definitely play a role in who you meet because unfortunately, people are not only closed-minded, but tend to gravitate towards the people who "fit" into their comfort zone.
Therefore, it does matter how you project yourself not only with verbal or non-verbal communication but by your appearance.
I find that although a lot of people post really useful information, there is certainly a lot of opinion expressed on these threads that just doesn't pertain to everyone. As a mainlander moving to the islands, one will face many of the same hurdles one would face anywhere, just in a different way. And although Hawaii may seem like a safe place, you definitely need to keep your wits about you--people take advantage of others everyday, everywhere. My main point in my previous thread was to say that integrity and a positive attitude go a long way in locals giving you respect, not at all saying that you should walk around in dangerous areas and say aloha to eveyone.
Isolated incidents of random violence can happen anywhere and I just don't want people to be discouraged and fearful that some "local" is going to beat their brains in because they're white. Hate crimes can happen anywhere and a few instances where we don't always get the full story from the media is no reason to walk around paranoid. That's where our culture is anyhow and by moving to Hawaii I hope to escape at least a little of that mainland based vibe.
The take home on this one is to be open minded about what people post here--go visit and see it for yourself--shop, eat and play where the locals hang out--meet a few people and you'll probably be surprised. Some obviously feel that posting fear based examples of bad behavior will discourage others from moving to their rock.
Thanks to all those who have made this forum what it is--a real cross section of people who live there, want to live there and those few jaded souls who hate it there.
Aloha and thank-you for posting this, Thornpicker. As a haole with an impending move, and a teenager and a young child, I don't need any more stress! However, I can also say that we once lived in Memphis and considered moving back there when we were also looking at the UH-M Cancer Center job and I must say that the race relations in Hawaii can't possibly scare me more than the conditions in Memphis!
I do appreciate your reassurance, however.
Mahalo!
Actually, I just gave 2 examples of how it does.
Your appearance has an impact on how you are perceived anywhere--not just Hawaii--besides "cues", people wear uniforms whether it's a hippie uniform, a jock uniform, a nerd uniform--whatever
Those particular ways we all have of expressing ourselves and definining who we are to the outside world definitely play a role in who you meet because unfortunately, people are not only closed-minded, but tend to gravitate towards the people who "fit" into their comfort zone.
Therefore, it does matter how you project yourself not only with verbal or non-verbal communication but by your appearance.
Okay let's review these 2 "examples"...
Quote:
Originally Posted by thornpicker
I was standing at a crosswalk waiting for the light when a "local" looked at me, asked me "what are you looking at? Get off my island." Not too friendly, but those people are definitely the exception.
Most likely, you inadvertently gave that particular local the "stink eye." The "get off my island" comment is a little unusual. Most locals of a similar disposition (we call them "mokes" and "titas") probably would have said, "haole, go home" with a couple of expletives thrown in for good measure. Of course, some details of this "exchange" might have been left out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thornpicker
I have Hispanic friends that when they go to Hawaii the locals treat them kindly because they look like them--then he tells them "I'm from Arizona". Hopefully it makes people stop and think.
"Hispanics" have a fairly long and interesting history in Hawai'i. Physical appearances notwithstanding, there is probably a distant kinship connection.
As for "uniforms," most of the locals in Hawai'i have the same basic "uniform" -- jeans or shorts, slippahs, T-shirts, "Aloha" shirts, mu'umu'u, holoku, etc. Although some tourists and newcomers to Hawai'i readily adopt the local "uniform," the non-verbal communication cues are an important factor in differentiating who is local and who isn't. We have locals of all shapes and sizes, colors, ethnicities, religions, orientations, etc. and we all manage to get along for the most part.
Overall, people in Hawai'i probably aren't as closed-minded as people in the continental United States. In fact, quite a few Hawai'i locals have "mainlander" relatives and friends and have spent some time on the "mainland" themselves. Unfortunately, the "mainland mentality" appears to be growing in Hawai'i as more folks from the continental U.S. move here and fail to adapt to local ways and as some locals adopt or retain "mainland" ways.
In many places on the "mainland," appearances count. In parts of O'ahu, Maui, Kaua'i, and the Big Island that have experienced a large influx of folks from the "mainland," that may also be the case. However, there are still many parts of Hawai'i where folks don't care what one looks like or how much is in one's bank account. Perhaps, the very act of someone from the "mainland" moving to those parts of Hawai'i will change them as well....
After reading all of these replies and stories of experiences in Hawaii I am amazed at how some people decided to focus on the negative aspects of what they experienced. Seems like pessimism flows as it goes.
I guess the whole perspective is relative to whether a person is a "Glass Half Empty or Glass Half Full" type of person.
I am being considered for a job opportunity in Honolulu and while the expensive cost of living and isolated remoteness of the island is a factor to consider, the larger portion of me knows that there will be no reservations or inhibitions once I am there.
Socially, I have never been in any situation where I could not adapt, assimilate or conform to the norms of the land. Hell if anything, wherever I have lived the 'natives' of the area gravitated to me. I love diversity and opportunity to learn a new way of living or partying. I do not expect anywhere to be remotely similar to where I am now, and if it was I would be TOTALLY disappointed.
Take it from a African-American living in Detroit. There is NO WAY I would allow ANYONE to ruin my social/living experience in Hawaii.
After reading all of these replies and stories of experiences in Hawaii I am amazed at how some people decided to focus on the negative aspects of what they experienced. Seems like pessimism flows as it goes.
I guess the whole perspective is relative to whether a person is a "Glass Half Empty or Glass Half Full" type of person.
I am being considered for a job opportunity in Honolulu and while the expensive cost of living and isolated remoteness of the island is a factor to consider, the larger portion of me knows that there will be no reservations or inhibitions once I am there.
Socially, I have never been in any situation where I could not adapt, assimilate or conform to the norms of the land. Hell if anything, wherever I have lived the 'natives' of the area gravitated to me. I love diversity and opportunity to learn a new way of living or partying. I do not expect anywhere to be remotely similar to where I am now, and if it was I would be TOTALLY disappointed.
Take it from a African-American living in Detroit. There is NO WAY I would allow ANYONE to ruin my social/living experience in Hawaii.
As an African American, you're probably used to being a minority. From Anthony D. Allen who opened the first resort in Waikiki during the early 1800s to Montgomery Earnest Thomas "Buttons" Kaluhiokalani and Barack Obama today, the experience of African Americans in Hawai'i is somewhat different from that of the typical European American "mainlander." Ever since Princes Alexander Liholiho and Lot Kapuaiwa Kamehameha (Kamehameha IV and Kamehameha V) were treated as African Americans by a train conductor in 1850, let's just say that there's a certain amount of empathy and accumulated goodwill.
Most likely, you inadvertently gave that particular local the "stink eye."
"Hispanics" have a fairly long and interesting history in Hawai'i. Physical appearances notwithstanding, there is probably a distant kinship connection.
.
Unbelievable
First, you seem to have an excuse for everything.
How in the world would you know what actually was said or exchanged? I by no means gave someone stink eye especially to someone who could kick my butt. Also, I don't remember seeing you at the crosswalk on Kapahulu Avenue that fine day.
How is it that you can so easily discount my experiences that I'm simply sharing to those who want to hear someone else's perspective? Are you the omnipotent regulator of Hawaii information? You do have some useful tips for people but I find the fact that you not once, but twice have reposted my same comments and discounted them, making way for what you think may have happened.
It's not only rude, but obnoxious as well.
I doubt that the people reading these threads are all that interested in you trying to nit-pick my words and flat out tell me that my experiences aren't what I think they are or that I said/did things that provoked a response. They're MY experiences and MY perception. Get over it.
I will continue to share my experiences living in Hawaii as well as potentially asking a few questions of my own. Can you handle someone else sharing their perception without patronizing me and trying to sound as if you are the only one who has an experience or an opinion?
If you disagree with me, fine, but don't try to make my experiences any less valid than your own.
As far as Metaphor's comment about negativity on these threads, yes some people (page before this one I think) have posted some really negative experiences--perhaps it's a good thing they leave the islands--better for us, better for them.
I was born and raised in Detroit and trust me, if anyplace was just like that, especially Hawaii , I would be totally disappointed too!!
Negative (real) experiences need to be shared as much as the positive ones simply because it really shows how someone else perceives their life there before you decide to make a move. I find it helpful anyways. I may not always agree, or my experiences may be different, but I'm glad I read them.
I'm glad some people appreciate my input, and I will share any that I have if it pertains to the topic regardless of anyone who feels compelled to pick my words apart and over analize them. As always I encourage all that read these posts to gain information by reading about experiences and opinions which I hope continue to be shared.
As far as Metaphor's comment about negativity on these threads, yes some people (page before this one I think) have posted some really negative experiences--perhaps it's a good thing they leave the islands--better for us, better for them.
I was born and raised in Detroit and trust me, if anyplace was just like that, especially Hawaii , I would be totally disappointed too!!
Negative (real) experiences need to be shared as much as the positive ones simply because it really shows how someone else perceives their life there before you decide to make a move. I find it helpful anyways. I may not always agree, or my experiences may be different, but I'm glad I read them.
I'm glad some people appreciate my input, and I will share any that I have if it pertains to the topic regardless of anyone who feels compelled to pick my words apart and over analize them. As always I encourage all that read these posts to gain information by reading about experiences and opinions which I hope continue to be shared.
Aloha
Thornpicker
I am not sure if you are referring to my post or not, but I will go ahead and explain my negative post. I had never really had any bad experiences on Maui, except for a couple. One time when I first moved here I was walking down South Kihei Rd. and some punk kids drove by and yelled "go back to your #$%^#@ hotel room". I pretty much brushed that off as that kind of stupid thing happens everywhere.
The second time was the day I posted my "negative" post. I was walking out of Foodland with 3 friends (2 haole, 1 Hawaiian) and a group of locals walked up to us and tried to start a brawl. We didn't even see them, we were just walking to our car! There we are at about 7pm, walking out of the grocery store with a cart full of groceries, completely minding our own business and 4 guys walk up to us and start name calling. We ignored them, not wanting to fight back and they let down. We quickly got into the car and left.
Having read the post earlier about that guy dying due to being hit I was scared to death. I was extremely upset and came home and vented my frustrations on this message board. My first thoughts were "oh my gosh, I want to leave the island". All these bad feelings were rushing through my mind thinking my boyfriend was going to get beat up... he wouldn't be able to work, we would lose our home, etc. Everything I have read about "haole hate" started flooding my mind...
Well after sleeping on it and calming down I woke up and realized not only could that have happened anywhere, but I was just feeding into all the negativity that I have been hearing so often. Hate crimes, rape, murder, attacks, kidnapping... it all happens everywhere, there is no place that is exempt from it. Looking back on it, the thought of running away from a few "punks" that like to start fights is just ridiculous! I have just as much right to be here as anyone else! And why should I give a few jerks the satisfaction of scaring me off the island?
I guess a big word of advice would be to just be aware of your surroundings and don't put yourself into knowingly dangerous situations. I have met so many amazing locals and Haoles alike... and yes there are a few bad eggs here, but there are everywhere. For the most part I feel very safe here. It would be silly for me to up and leave just because of one bad experience. If I did that I would be leaving places all the time!! So sorry about my original post, I am planning to stay and will continue my work with helping the Hawaiian people. The best way to be accepted is to show you care, and I do...
Both of you --Jonah and Thornpicker-- have contributed so much to these threads. You both have shed a wealth of good information.
Please do not let this particular thread degenerate into a flame war of personal attacks. Let's just leave this not seeing eye-to-eye on some points alone for awhile.
I've been so impressed with this forum in that the banter has been of such quality. I'd hate to have to start deleting posts the way we have to do on other forums on this board.
First, you seem to have an excuse for everything.
How in the world would you know what actually was said or exchanged? I by no means gave someone stink eye especially to someone who could kick my butt. Also, I don't remember seeing you at the crosswalk on Kapahulu Avenue that fine day.
How is it that you can so easily discount my experiences that I'm simply sharing to those who want to hear someone else's perspective? Are you the omnipotent regulator of Hawaii information? You do have some useful tips for people but I find the fact that you not once, but twice have reposted my same comments and discounted them, making way for what you think may have happened.
It's not only rude, but obnoxious as well.
I doubt that the people reading these threads are all that interested in you trying to nit-pick my words and flat out tell me that my experiences aren't what I think they are or that I said/did things that provoked a response. They're MY experiences and MY perception. Get over it.
I will continue to share my experiences living in Hawaii as well as potentially asking a few questions of my own. Can you handle someone else sharing their perception without patronizing me and trying to sound as if you are the only one who has an experience or an opinion?
If you disagree with me, fine, but don't try to make my experiences any less valid than your own.
As far as Metaphor's comment about negativity on these threads, yes some people (page before this one I think) have posted some really negative experiences--perhaps it's a good thing they leave the islands--better for us, better for them.
I was born and raised in Detroit and trust me, if anyplace was just like that, especially Hawaii , I would be totally disappointed too!!
Negative (real) experiences need to be shared as much as the positive ones simply because it really shows how someone else perceives their life there before you decide to make a move. I find it helpful anyways. I may not always agree, or my experiences may be different, but I'm glad I read them.
I'm glad some people appreciate my input, and I will share any that I have if it pertains to the topic regardless of anyone who feels compelled to pick my words apart and over analize them. As always I encourage all that read these posts to gain information by reading about experiences and opinions which I hope continue to be shared.
Aloha
Thornpicker
Ah, a perfect illustration of the "mainland mentality" -- the inability to take a little criticism, coupled with jumping to conclusions and a strong sense of "self-importance." No need to throw a "hissy fit."
It's of little importance whether or not you actually gave that particular "local" (or person that you perceived to be a "local") the "stink eye" on that "fine day" on Kapahulu Ave. However, based on your account, it's likely that the "local" in question thought that you gave him (or her) the "stink eye" and responded accordingly. No one really knows what the "local" in question was thinking; however, there are at least two sides to every story. Cultural misunderstandings are a daily occurrence in Hawai'i (and elsewhere) and something that all of us can learn from.
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