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They're coming from a pretty dense part of Brooklyn, so yea, most of Philadelphia is going to look pretty quaint. There was also already an expression of skepticism over commute times from Princeton, so I can't see how South Jersey would fare there. At least in parts of Philadelphia there are easy and frequent routes to the 30th Street Station to take relatively speedy Amtrak.
For example, this relatively nice and moderately bustling part of Philadelphia is quaint (and very affordable) compared to this in Brooklyn. I have nothing against South Jersey or its cities. They're great, but I think they're generally even less urban than most of the other places mentioned here and are going to be a harder commute especially by transit. I'm also not saying that he shouldn't consider your South Jersey mentions which are great. Only that if he wants very walkable and quaint and South Jersey isn't stricken off for the commute, then he should look into parts of Philadelphia.
Last edited by OyCrumbler; 03-16-2022 at 08:43 PM..
It is also disingenuous to the poster to say that you could live in NJ (outside Hoboken, Jersey City, or Newark) without a car. There is not enough mass transit, even in train towns with bus support, to reasonably consider living without a car.
Occasionally taking a leisure trip to the mall by bus is not the same trying to squeeze a trip to the mall into a busy schedule or visit a doctor's office 4 miles from your home and nowhere near a bus route.
I live in a Bergen County train town less than a mile from the train station. When I was commuting by train to NYC, I always drove to the train station because I did not want to add 20 minutes each way to my 1:20 commute. Once we had kids, we had daycare drop off and pickup in our town and then there was before care and after care during elementary school. This would be impossible to do the drop offs/pickups and commute by train without a car.
Here is some other things to consider for walking:
The 2 lane roads we all use to drive all over NJ do not always have sidewalks or any safe space to walk.
There is year around variable weather in NJ.
The sun comes up late and goes down early in Nov/Dec/Jan making it hard for drivers to see walkers.
Walkers are not common and therefore unexpected to drivers.
The reality is you need a car to live in NJ.
It's easier if you have a car. No one disputes that. But the OP said they do not want to have a car, and so we are trying to think of places and provide information as to how to do that.
I am pretty sure people from Brooklyn know about fall/winter sunsets and are smart enough to know about walking on dark roads.
I caught a bus to Ridgewood for years. Six-minute bus ride, two or three minutes from my front door to the bus stop. Add time for the schedule, etc, but it wasn't 20 extra minutes.
And I already know people in the Red Bank area who use taxis and ride sharing to get to doctor appointments and other places.
It can be done, better in some places than in others.
there are plenty of new buildings in the ironbound section of newark, several minute's walk from penn station, with its nj transit trains and path trains. also, there are new lofts in the downtown newark broad street area. also, harrison has many brand new buildings and a PATH stop as well. Of course, private or parochial schools should most definately be utilized, but it is an option for those who don't have a car.
also, car rental, when and if needed, or even buying a car for some long distance trip, and selling it immediately thereafter, might be an option. former government cars, such as ford taurus and chevy malibus, are usually well maintained, have low mileage, and are sold for far, far less than cars on even craigslist or on lots.
there are plenty of new buildings in the ironbound section of newark, several minute's walk from penn station, with its nj transit trains and path trains. also, there are new lofts in the downtown newark broad street area. also, harrison has many brand new buildings and a PATH stop as well. Of course, private or parochial schools should most definately be utilized, but it is an option for those who don't have a car.
The ironbound is a good choice. Also, Harrison is very up and coming, but I'm not sure about houses there for rent. More likely apartments.
The OP did not mention kids, just a set of parents that will move in with them.
Some parts of Newark might be OK, but other parts are more runnable than walkable.
i knew a woman who lived in philly and commuted to the world trade center on some sort of express train, monday through friday. a lot of folk (used to??!!) do it, and she was a big michener reader. after a year, though, she was fried and quit!
This is not true. It is not helpful to say such stupid things to people who are looking to move to an area with which they are not familiar, so please stop with the damn negativity and your feeble attempts to mislead new posters.
There are local buses running between towns in many parts of the state, although they don't serve every area. For example, when I didn't have a car and lived in Bergen County, I used to use the bus line that runs from Oakland to Hackensack to go shopping in Ridgewood from Midland Park or to get to and from the train station.
In Red Bank, which has one of the best walkable downtowns in New Jersey, there are several local buses that can take you to Long Branch, which has beaches and Pier Village and its own walkable sections, such a Brighton Avenue, as well as taxi service, or the Monmouth Mall or Freehold and other destinations. It does have a train to the city, as well as a couple of local taxi services, or you can take the train to shore points farther south.
Rather than try to figure out what lines you would use on the NJTransit website, here's a Wiki article that gives you a snapshot under "Routes".
I'm being real, you cannot get around NJ on Public Transportation as a primary source of transportation. I'll give you an example, if I want to get to the Short Hills Mall from my house its a 15 minute car ride, or a 2 hour bus ride. Sometimes you might get a good route on where you need to go, but to go a grocery store, unless you live walking distance (unlikely for most people) good luck getting transportation there. I'm setting expectations where they need to be set.
i knew a woman who lived in philly and commuted to the world trade center on some sort of express train, monday through friday. a lot of folk (used to??!!) do it, and she was a big michener reader. after a year, though, she was fried and quit!
Yes, we had a consultant from Philly who was coming in every day by train. Eventually he took an apartment in the city to stay during the week for the duration of the project, because it was just too much. Of course, he was making the bucks to do that.
I'm being real, you cannot get around NJ on Public Transportation as a primary source of transportation. I'll give you an example, if I want to get to the Short Hills Mall from my house its a 15 minute car ride, or a 2 hour bus ride. Sometimes you might get a good route on where you need to go, but to go a grocery store, unless you live walking distance (unlikely for most people) good luck getting transportation there. I'm setting expectations where they need to be set.
But most people who don't drive and need to go to a grocery store spend the money they aren't spending on a car and insurance on taxis or Uber/Lyft services. I see cabs all the time at the grocery stores in places like Red Bank and used to see them in Ridgewood, too. Now there are grocery delivery services, too. Or you click on your Uber app. People who don't drive know these things. I even know a lady in her 70s who can no longer drive because of a medical issue. She goes shopping, to lunch, to visit friends via Uber.
I HAVE a car, but I don't do big grocery shopping trips because I hate shopping and I rarely buy more at one time than I can put through the Express Lane or the self-service lane and that I can carry from my car to the house in one trip. So, if I want something specific from my ShopRite or just food for a day or two, I sometimes do the ten-minute walk to the store and pick up what's easy to carry home. Of course, the OP is a family of four adults, so that might not work, but maybe it would.
It's something to take into consideration--does the town you want to move to HAVE taxi services? It's a definite yes for towns like Red Bank or Ridgewood or Long Branch (the last one having less of a defined nice downtown except for maybe the West End section.) You have to call them, of course. It's not the same as Brooklyn where you just saunter out to the street and raise your hand, but they are everywhere. And if you want to go to Monmouth Mall, you hop on the 835 and it's ten minutes or so down 35. If you want to go to the city or to the beaches or even for Portuguese food at the Ironbound in Newark, you get on the North Jersey Coast Line, which has frequent service and runs pretty late into the night.
Short Hills might not be the best area for that. That's why we are trying to tell the OP the places that ARE.
I'm being real, you cannot get around NJ on Public Transportation as a primary source of transportation. I'll give you an example, if I want to get to the Short Hills Mall from my house its a 15 minute car ride, or a 2 hour bus ride. Sometimes you might get a good route on where you need to go, but to go a grocery store, unless you live walking distance (unlikely for most people) good luck getting transportation there. I'm setting expectations where they need to be set.
Have you tried? When was the last time you tried this? Do you use mass transit to get around? Do you walk more than ten minutes a day? Do you use Lyft/Uber? Do you buy stuff online to be delivered? Do you use any car rental apps?
Interesting point about Short Hills Mall to your house isn't great without a car, but that info's just useful enough to means OP shouldn't consider living in your neighborhood if the intention is to work at Short Hills Mall. Great.
The OP was specifically asking for places where it's doable, not for places where it's not. If there are people who are doing this and have this experience, then they're probably better qualified to say where it's doable. You admit that you don't know how to do this and you have no experience since you keep saying that you cannot get around without a car--then perhaps consider that you have no knowledge or experience with this and are giving uninformed advice. It seems pretty bizarre to me that you're weighing in despite not having ever done this before. It's like someone asking about training to run a marathon and your response is to insist it can't be done because you've never done it. And...? So what? What does it matter that you have not and cannot do it? Why not have people who actually know give usable advice instead of just insisting that your (lack of) experience is universal?
Last edited by OyCrumbler; 03-17-2022 at 11:08 AM..
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