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Maybe, I'll agree that Tulsa and even OKC are more Midwestern and Western. But SE OK where I spend a fair amount of time for work is really just Southern. But not "Old South" Southern.
I’m from Georgia and currently live in Oklahoma and my opinion is that Oklahomans try to hard to be southern. I have never in my 15 years of living here met somebody with a southern accent. I’m laughing when people that have never been to or lived in an actual southern state think that Oklahoma is southern. In Rossville Georgia there are more trailers than houses, in Tulsa Oklahoma it’s just suburbs filled with apartments and homes. Georgia has Hardee’s and Oklahoma has Braums, stop comparing at best a southeastern state to a true southern state. Btw Oklahoma was Native American Territory and Native Americans fought with the confederacy. Stop fooling yourselves.
You may not hear a "southern" accent being from Georgia, but non southerners do hear it. But I'd agree that Oklahoma accents aren't exactly like the deep south.
As far as your comments about Hardee's. We used to have Hardees all over the place. They got bought out by Carls Jr. about 20 years ago. I miss Hardees a lot.
I’m from Georgia and currently live in Oklahoma and my opinion is that Oklahomans try to hard to be southern. I have never in my 15 years of living here met somebody with a southern accent. I’m laughing when people that have never been to or lived in an actual southern state think that Oklahoma is southern. In Rossville Georgia there are more trailers than houses, in Tulsa Oklahoma it’s just suburbs filled with apartments and homes. Georgia has Hardee’s and Oklahoma has Braums, stop comparing at best a southeastern state to a true southern state. Btw Oklahoma was Native American Territory and Native Americans fought with the confederacy. Stop fooling yourselves.
Well, we here in the good ol' Southwest don't need some heifer from Georgia with an attitude, so you're welcome to return to the DEEP South.
As for Okies trying to be Southern, that's just weird. I don't see anyone trying to be anything other than what we are, a strong mix of Western and Southern. Furthermore, along those lines, I just returned from the Deep South (Mississippi and Alabama) and it was my impression that folks over in the Southeast were trying to be Cowboys, when in fact, we have real ones here out on the Southern Plains of Oklahoma.
You may not hear a "southern" accent being from Georgia, but non southerners do hear it. But I'd agree that Oklahoma accents aren't exactly like the deep south.
The OP's original question is a poorly worded one. The real query is "Do Oklahomans typically have a Southern or Western accent?" Oklahomans sound nothing like someone from Wisconsin, Ohio, Minnesota, Michigan, etc...you know, the real Midwest. There are people I run into for work from Kansas and Upper Missouri and even they sound different.
I would argue that Oklahoma is much more a mixture of western & southern than anything else. I think the western element is so strong because of our pioneer history and our Cowboy/Ag culture, certainly in OK City and surrounding area. Oklahoma is the true SOUTHwest along with a chunk of tejas and parts of Arkie.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eddie gein
As far as your comments about Hardee's. We used to have Hardees all over the place. They got bought out by Carls Jr. about 20 years ago. I miss Hardees a lot.
I miss Hardees too, especially that Hot Ham & Cheese. But, as you noted, Carl's Jr. bought up the Hardees in Oklahoma and Texas and changed the name. The main difference is that Hardees made fried burgers while Carl's Jr. is into the flame broiled. I don't miss Hardees burgers all that much as Braum's pretty much destroys 'em. If you go to Carl's Jr. in Oklahoma for breakfast, it still has a Hardee's wrapper, which is strange. At least that's how it was in Marietta and also at the one in Norman that I ate at. I go there to get the Double Loaded Omelet Biscuit. It is something from Heaven, but a heart attack in a sack!
The OP's original question is a poorly worded one. The real query is "Do Oklahomans typically have a Southern or Western accent?" Oklahomans sound nothing like someone from Wisconsin, Ohio, Minnesota, Michigan, etc...you know, the real Midwest. There are people I run into for work from Kansas and Upper Missouri and even they sound different.
I would argue that Oklahoma is much more a mixture of western & southern than anything else. I think the western element is so strong because of our pioneer history and our Cowboy/Ag culture, certainly in OK City and surrounding area. Oklahoma is the true SOUTHwest along with a chunk of tejas and parts of Arkie.
It's interesting in that my family is originally from around the Enid area. I consider NW Oklahoma the LEAST southern area of Oklahoma and I do not consider my folks to have a southern accent. However, when I lived in Arizona and a would talk to them on the phone I could hear what I considered an accent that could be considered an accent from them. I moved from Arizona to northern Florida. The accents were so much more pronounced down there than they were in Oklahoma that when I'd talk to my folks their accent sounded neutral.
When I think about this question I think of Reba. She has what I would consider one of the stronger types of accents in Oklahoma. There are some people who sound like her and then I think you can work back to a more neutral accent for most people in Oklahoma. As I have said, there ARE some people in parts of Oklahoma who do have a more northern plains accent in the NW part of the state particularly. But even Reba has more of a twangy accent and not what I would call a classical southern accent. My experience in the south though is that some of the people down there are way past Reba even with the twanging.
I miss Hardees too, especially that Hot Ham & Cheese. But, as you noted, Carl's Jr. bought up the Hardees in Oklahoma and Texas and changed the name. The main difference is that Hardees made fried burgers while Carl's Jr. is into the flame broiled. I don't miss Hardees burgers all that much as Braum's pretty much destroys 'em. If you go to Carl's Jr. in Oklahoma for breakfast, it still has a Hardee's wrapper, which is strange. At least that's how it was in Marietta and also at the one in Norman that I ate at. I go there to get the Double Loaded Omelet Biscuit. It is something from Heaven, but a heart attack in a sack!
I don't mind Carls Jr burgers, it's just that so many of them have closed. I just remember when I was younger and had taste buds that were still alive, I lived in Norman close to the Hardee's by Heisman square and hit it quite frequently. Loved the breakfasts, they had what was called a Frisco burger that I really liked. and their pies were tasty, but that was then and this is now.
But a few years back I went to Indiana for a week and ate a breakfast, lunch and a dinner at Hardee's for old times sake.
I’m from Georgia and currently live in Oklahoma and my opinion is that Oklahomans try to hard to be southern. I have never in my 15 years of living here met somebody with a southern accent. I’m laughing when people that have never been to or lived in an actual southern state think that Oklahoma is southern. In Rossville Georgia there are more trailers than houses, in Tulsa Oklahoma it’s just suburbs filled with apartments and homes. Georgia has Hardee’s and Oklahoma has Braums, stop comparing at best a southeastern state to a true southern state. Btw Oklahoma was Native American Territory and Native Americans fought with the confederacy. Stop fooling yourselves.
My tribe never fought for the confederacy. Stop fooling yourself. FYI, western OK was Indian Territory, the eastern half of OK was Oklahoma Territory. With 40+ tribes each tribe had its own alliances. Obviously the tribes from eastern and southern states had a lot different history than the southern plains tribes.
The old adage "the enemy of my enemy..." rings true.
People who are born and raisedin rural Oklahoma do have a strong Okie accent compared to metro areas. Personally, I have never considered OK to be a part of the deep south.
My tribe never fought for the confederacy. Stop fooling yourself. FYI, western OK was Indian Territory, the eastern half of OK was Oklahoma Territory. With 40+ tribes each tribe had its own alliances. Obviously the tribes from eastern and southern states had a lot different history than the southern plains tribes.
The old adage "the enemy of my enemy..." rings true.
People who are born and raisedin rural Oklahoma do have a strong Okie accent compared to metro areas. Personally, I have never considered OK to be a part of the deep south.
I think you meant "western half of OK was Oklahoma territory." That being said, although all 5 of the so called civilized tribes signed treaties aligning with the confederacy, this caused a split in the Creek/Seminole and particularly the Cherokee tribes.
As stated before, the question do Oklahoman's have a "Southern or Midwestern" accent simply isn't the right question. Nothing about a true Okie accent (or anything about Oklahoma, period) is "Midwestern".
The term "Midwestern" occassionally finds it way into the lexicon around Oklahoma because we're (generally) in the "mid"dle of the country. So even people with a twangy type of Okie accent who haven't been educated on our state's history, geography and heritage will sometimes say Oklahoma is in the Midwest, but they're simply wrong. This is not the Midwest, and frankly it's not even close.
The Midwest starts somewhere up around Kansas City, Mo.-Des Moines, Iowa-Lincoln, Nebraska and extends NORTH and EAST. It certainly doesn't extend SOUTH and WEST down to Oklahoma. It's like comparing Iowa to Arkansas. Just because the two states fall basically into the same north-south parallel of the country, doesn't mean they have anything in common.
The accent in Oklahoma is a blend of a slow Southern speech pattern with a kind of Southwestern, Texas, Cowboy, or just "Okie" twang. It's certainly not the same as someone speaking old Southern English from Georgia or South Carolina...but it's more in line with the way folks talk in North Texas, Arkansas and perhaps even Northern Louisiana (certainly not Southern La.). So it IS "Southern", but not "Southern" as in Scarlett O'Hara, or the great Civil War historian Shelby Foote of Mississippi.
Having lived in central Oklahoma my entire life and being a fourth-generation Okie, I consider myself a Southerner, but not in the same light as someone from Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, etc. might. We ARE in the southern part of America (a geographic fact), but we are a fascinating transition point between the traditional American South and the American West. Parts of western Oklahoma feel a whole lot like New Mexico and West Texas (another region in and of itself). While points east of Oklahoma City can feel like Arkansas and Louisiana.
The real distinction can be found as you drive north on I-35 into Kansas. Southern Kansas feels different than Oklahoma. I understand this can be a little subjective, but it truly has a different feel. There's less Bermudagrass and Crape Myrtles. Any type of twangy accent basically disappears. There's a much more open, vast landscape with fewer trees. It's just different. The same differences aren't experiences traveling south on I-35 into Texas.
So with the exception of our friends south of the Red River, Oklahoma is the only state in America where both piñon pine (a western pine tree) grows naturally in the same state as the Loblolly pine (see Augusta National Golf Club and the deep South), and we're the only two states where antelope roam our western prairies on the same day that American Alligators swim in our eastern bayous. Dichotomies like these (and countless others) kind of sum up the interesting transition point that we are in the United States and help to prove that we simply are not a Midwestern state.
As stated before, the question do Oklahoman's have a "Southern or Midwestern" accent simply isn't the right question. Nothing about a true Okie accent (or anything about Oklahoma, period) is "Midwestern".
The term "Midwestern" occassionally finds it way into the lexicon around Oklahoma because we're (generally) in the "mid"dle of the country. So even people with a twangy type of Okie accent who haven't been educated on our state's history, geography and heritage will sometimes say Oklahoma is in the Midwest, but they're simply wrong. This is not the Midwest, and frankly it's not even close.
The Midwest starts somewhere up around Kansas City, Mo.-Des Moines, Iowa-Lincoln, Nebraska and extends NORTH and EAST. It certainly doesn't extend SOUTH and WEST down to Oklahoma. It's like comparing Iowa to Arkansas. Just because the two states fall basically into the same north-south parallel of the country, doesn't mean they have anything in common.
The accent in Oklahoma is a blend of a slow Southern speech pattern with a kind of Southwestern, Texas, Cowboy, or just "Okie" twang. It's certainly not the same as someone speaking old Southern English from Georgia or South Carolina...but it's more in line with the way folks talk in North Texas, Arkansas and perhaps even Northern Louisiana (certainly not Southern La.). So it IS "Southern", but not "Southern" as in Scarlett O'Hara, or the great Civil War historian Shelby Foote of Mississippi.
Having lived in central Oklahoma my entire life and being a fourth-generation Okie, I consider myself a Southerner, but not in the same light as someone from Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, etc. might. We ARE in the southern part of America (a geographic fact), but we are a fascinating transition point between the traditional American South and the American West. Parts of western Oklahoma feel a whole lot like New Mexico and West Texas (another region in and of itself). While points east of Oklahoma City can feel like Arkansas and Louisiana.
The real distinction can be found as you drive north on I-35 into Kansas. Southern Kansas feels different than Oklahoma. I understand this can be a little subjective, but it truly has a different feel. There's less Bermudagrass and Crape Myrtles. Any type of twangy accent basically disappears. There's a much more open, vast landscape with fewer trees. It's just different. The same differences aren't experiences traveling south on I-35 into Texas.
So with the exception of our friends south of the Red River, Oklahoma is the only state in America where both piñon pine (a western pine tree) grows naturally in the same state as the Loblolly pine (see Augusta National Golf Club and the deep South), and we're the only two states where antelope roam our western prairies on the same day that American Alligators swim in our eastern bayous. Dichotomies like these (and countless others) kind of sum up the interesting transition point that we are in the United States and help to prove that we simply are not a Midwestern state.
This is about as thorough of an explanation that I've ever seen regarding Oklahoma's culture and geography. It took me back to my Fifth Grade Geography Class (ages ago!).
Excellent job of describing nuances of our Okie speech as well as the unique topographical traits of Oklahoma.
Ha! Thanks! The topic of which region Oklahoma fits in has always fascinated me...just wanted to share my 2 cents. It drives me crazy when people call us the Midwest...it's like calling someone from California a New Englander! Couldn't be any less accurate! haha
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I don't see anyone trying to be anything other than what we are, a strong mix of Western and Southern. Furthermore, along those lines, I just returned from the Deep South (Mississippi and Alabama) and it was my impression that folks over in the Southeast were trying to be Cowboys, when in fact, we have real ones here out on the Southern Plains of Oklahoma.
Asking the wrong question
