Could downtown Phoenix finally get an entertainment district? (Glendale, Scottsdale: living, safer)

[locolife]

Originally Posted by swaysway

LA has Santa Monica with the Pier, Venice with the walkways and beaches with outdoor gyms, and so many other beaches.

That’s the hard thing with the Valley in general. There’s nowhere to just go hang out except the mall or maybe a coffee shop.

Really? This was just a random photo I took on a weekend in May at town lake. And some Google photos.




https://www.google.com/maps/@33.4319...0!8i3040?hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.4311...2!8i4682?hl=en

And here is what is part of what else is planned to come with what is already under construction on the east side of the lake will really activate that area as well.

[OUgrad09]

Encanto seems like a good spot to hang out. Really each city in metro PHX needs to create those gathering spaces, whether it’s “entertainment” focused or not. Being from LA, sure there is LA Live which has a plaza and a few restaurants but it’s by no means “the” gathering spot in the city. I absolutely never go there, as it’s too much of a headache to get there, parking is a mess, too many homeless, etc. the different areas of LA have plenty of spots to go for a walk, shop/eat, rooftop bars, etc. so there’s no reason for people in LA to drive super far for their hangout spots. That is the model sprawly cities should follow.

However there is nothing wrong with developing a centralized entertainment area in DT PHX that can be used as a major gathering spot for cultural events that is adjacent to other DT sites of interest/amenities.

[locolife]

Originally Posted by OUgrad09

Encanto seems like a good spot to hang out. Really each city in metro PHX needs to create those gathering spaces, whether it’s “entertainment” focused or not. Being from LA, sure there is LA Live which has a plaza and a few restaurants but it’s by no means “the” gathering spot in the city. I absolutely never go there, as it’s too much of a headache to get there, parking is a mess, too many homeless, etc. the different areas of LA have plenty of spots to go for a walk, shop/eat, rooftop bars, etc. so there’s no reason for people in LA to drive super far for their hangout spots. That is the model sprawly cities should follow.

However there is nothing wrong with developing a centralized entertainment area in DT PHX that can be used as a major gathering spot for cultural events that is adjacent to other DT sites of interest/amenities.

Yeah, this is fairly true in Phoenix as well. I don't have an issue with the entertainment district, if it's designed well and not overly filled with chains that would be great.

• Scottsdale has multiple gathering spots in old town from the waterfront area to the Civic Mall and multiple spots along the greenbelt.
• Tempe has Mill Ave and town lake as major gathering spots.
• Downtown Phoenix has the Cityscape area with restaurants, splash pad and this time of year ice-skating along with Hance Park on the north end of the city.
• Glendale has Westgate; with multiple sports centers and a bit of a town square feel in the middle, I actually prefer downtown Glendale but it's still somewhat up and coming.
• North Scottsdale/North Phoenix have the Kierland/Scottsdale Quarter areas. Yes, they're both technically outdoor malls but fairly integrated in a semi-urban design with semi-public amenities like splash pads and green spaces.

[OUgrad09]

Yes, and again, there’s nothing wrong with “shopping” being available at a public gathering spot. Why do you think Europeans in the Middle Ages went into town to the public square? It wasn’t just for public executions and performances, it generally was because it was the hub of economic activity. But as you said, the shopping and dining needs to be integrated into the urban fabric and not be a mall island which was a popular model in the 1970-2000s, but has become a woefully outdated concept that is obviously struggling.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by locolife

And here is what is part of what else is planned to come with what is already under construction on the east side of the lake will really activate that area as well.

If that's the planned South Pier project, I agree it looks impressive. The key word is: PLANNED. Nothing is final until the development is fully completed, and you should know this based on how many other seemingly impressive projects have been needlessly delayed, scaled back, or scrapped. The Phoenix area has a reputation of over promising, but under delivering when it comes to these kinds of proposals.

[timothyaw]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

If that's the planned South Pier project, I agree it looks impressive. The key word is: PLANNED. Nothing is final until the development is fully completed, and you should know this based on how many other seemingly impressive projects have been needlessly delayed, scaled back, or scrapped. The Phoenix area has a reputation of over promising, but under delivering when it comes to these kinds of proposals.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Tempe delivered on their promises especially when it comes to the lakefront?

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by timothyaw

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Tempe delivered on their promises especially when it comes to the lakefront?

As far as I know, yes, but my point is that it's too early to be popping the champagne bottle on a development which hasn't even broken ground yet. History has proven that too many projects are planned & given lots of hype, only to be delayed, scaled back, or not built at all. Case in point: Astra. This has been on the books for over 3 years, and sounded ever so promising. I remember Locolife even said last year that somebody he keeps in touch with informed him that Astra would break ground during the fourth quarter of 2022. Here it is 2023 and still no action! As far as I'm concerned, these projects are dead in the water until cranes & construction crews are in motion.

[locolife]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

As far as I know, yes, but my point is that it's too early to be popping the champagne bottle on a development which hasn't even broken ground yet. History has proven that too many projects are planned & given lots of hype, only to be delayed, scaled back, or not built at all. Case in point: Astra. This has been on the books for over 3 years, and sounded ever so promising. I remember Locolife even said last year that somebody he keeps in touch with informed him that Astra would break ground during the fourth quarter of 2022. Here it is 2023 and still no action! As far as I'm concerned, these projects are dead in the water until cranes & construction crews are in motion.

Who popped a champagne bottle on The Pier? I said it's planned, you said it's planned, hopefully it goes through! And as another poster pointed out Tempe has had pretty good success with projects coming together. Astra has changed probably as a result of office space demand but I don't work in real estate I just hear about permitting and such, as far as Astra goes there should be no delays being caused by permitting by the city of Phoenix, which is a good position to be in. But if the economics of assumptions in their pro-forma have changed then things may be on hold until it makes sense again. It's a nearly $500M project, a lot goes into planning for that. Empire group should have the cash to move ahead so it sucks that it's delayed, hopefully they're retooling with a hotel to replace the office space and can move ahead this year.

Also you're quick to point out negatives but I also said Central Station would move forward (two towers, one 33 stories and one 22 stories) and indeed cranes are in the ground now. Why no credit there only for one that is delayed? HMMM

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by locolife

Also you're quick to point out negatives but I also said Central Station would move forward (two towers, one 33 stories and one 22 stories) and indeed cranes are in the ground now. Why no credit there only for one that is delayed? HMMM

You call it negative when I point out factual information which doesn't always agree with your overly optimistic outlook. Yes, Central Station is moving forward, and I'd say it's about time since the project was delayed for 8 years. Sorry, but I'm just pointing out another fact which you'll likely label as negative. When projects like Astra (and others) are heavily promoted in their initial stage, and then we see or hear nothing for years on end, that can create skepticism & distrust. You should understand this.

[locolife]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

You call it negative when I point out factual information which doesn't always agree with your overly optimistic outlook. Yes, Central Station is moving forward, and I'd say it's about time since the project was delayed for 8 years. Sorry, but I'm just pointing out another fact which you'll likely label as negative. When projects like Astra (and others) are heavily promoted in their initial stage, and then we see or hear nothing for years on end, that can create skepticism & distrust. You should understand this.

Thanks for the credit on central station, it is moving forward.

See it's not so hard to give credit when it's due. Maybe Astra will happen and maybe it won't. You're correct it's still in proposed stage and with your standards I guess we don't talk about anything proposed until a crane is in the ground. Or you can just ignore those posts because most of us like speculation and seeing what is proposed.

For you, these are the 12 most impactful projects currently "under construction" that can be considered moving forward for you. Combined they should add something like 5,000 new living units downtown and this isn't everything, just a top 12 list. I'd say we'll be seeing multiple impacts that should improve downtown, 1. a lot more people downtown and 2. less available land to build on, which will drive more height.


https://azbigmedia.com/real-estate/1...own-phoenix-2/