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I'm not so sure I agree with your list. Only 8% of the population golfed at least once a year.
We might be confusing playing golf recreationally vs. the interest in large scale tournaments. Notice how much of a crowd the Phoenix Open draws every year (as just one example).
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Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised
Yes, people come here for a job. That's mandatory. But there are jobs EVERYWHERE. So sure, higher quality jobs have attracted people here. And work from home allowed for an explosion of migration to multiple west coast cities.
No arguments here, but I would add that the more reasonable cost of living is also causing the migration from the west coast to places like Phoenix. It's mainly economic conditions: availability of decent paying jobs plus fairly affordable cost of living (although certainly not cheap like it used to be).
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Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised
Still, the weather is discussed multiple times in every website because of the total ideal days per year. In summary, PHX metro has most of the package needed to attract more higher-income people. If the weather sucked, a whole lot less people would be coming here.
I respectfully disagree, and one of the reasons is: the majority of Fortune 500 companies are still located primarily in metros with less than ideal climates. New York, Chicago, D.C., Boston, and Minneapolis have frequent hazardous winter weather conditions. Houston is prone to hurricanes & severe storms. Dallas can have ice storms & tornadoes. Every city on this list receives much more rainfall than Phoenix does. But yet, these are the places to go for higher paying jobs. If weather matters so much in this regard, then the city with the most perfect weather in the nation (San Diego) should have a plethora of corporate HQs and high paying jobs. But San Diego severely lacks in this area for other reasons.
Heck, the lack of weather issues is why data centers are here. And while we are gabbing, the semiconductor companies come here more and more because the ground is seismically stable! As the topology layouts get smaller, earth movement matters! Read about it here https://fpt-semiconductor.com/blogs/...-construction/ .
Data centers generally offer lower pay than the actual HQs or corporate offices. I'm sure there is opportunity for higher salaries, but it seems to be more limited from what I've seen. The Phoenix area is a growing tech market, which is fine, but we can't ignore the importance of other businesses (pharmaceuticals, finance, insurance, manufacturing, etc.). Again, look up where a lot of those companies are based ... not here!
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Originally Posted by wilberry
No hurricanes, No sustained humidity, No tornados , no mudslides, no forest fires , No blizzards, no torrential rains, no River floods, lots of job offers, somewhat moderate pay , with the " promise of someday owning your own 350-400 K home " compare to NY, LA , Chicago , Houston ,............
Somewhat moderate pay usually isn't enough to afford a SFH. Besides, many homes that are valued between $350K to $400K these days are located in lower income areas, and/or are smaller sized. Otherwise, enjoy all that great weather while being stuck in an apartment.
We might be confusing playing golf recreationally vs. the interest in large scale tournaments. Notice how much of a crowd the Phoenix Open draws every year (as just one example).
The PHX Open does draw tourism. And I'm sure some retirees want to live in a golf community. NO ONE is going to move to PHX to be around golf tournaments.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valley Native
I respectfully disagree, and one of the reasons is: the majority of Fortune 500 companies are still located primarily in metros with less than ideal climates. New York, Chicago, D.C., Boston, and Minneapolis have frequent hazardous winter weather conditions. Houston is prone to hurricanes & severe storms. Dallas can have ice storms & tornadoes. Every city on this list receives much more rainfall than Phoenix does. But yet, these are the places to go for higher paying jobs.
PHX attracts people where the weather matters. I didn't say PHX attracts HQ's. And I didn't say ALL people are attracted to sunny weather. I mean, people live in Alaska. That subset of people doesn't care NEARLY as much as the people living in a sunnier and warmer climate. Example: if you live in Oklahoma City. Your priority isn't downhill skiing, hiking in the mountains, beaches, etc. And of course, having a way to make a living matters to everyone. Hence, people who decide or study to move to AZ often discuss the weather as an important reason why they are here. That's a fact. And it should be abundantly clear that people hit the eject button to get out of ___________. And the topic of weather is quickly mentioned.
In my case, I lived in MN (and still do part-time) because of an extremely important factor: I was born there! Period. It had nothing to do with the weather. Later you move when you get sick of it. It's the same reason why many people LEAVE AZ: summers suck! Yes, the weather matters.
And while we are gabbing, a lot of companies in the past dodged AZ. Because of the school rankings which correlated to school expenditures. Many (not all) companies consider the brainpower of the workforce. And in AZ, the former K-12 reputation was dismal. How do you think MA and MN attracted so many businesses? Was it the low tax rates?! Nope!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valley Native
If weather matters so much in this regard, then the city with the most perfect weather in the nation (San Diego) should have a plethora of corporate HQs and high paying jobs. But San Diego severely lacks in this area for other reasons.
It's the same reason why the perfect weather of Carmel/Monterey attracts even fewer businesses. Because San Fran gobbles up the companies. Just like LA gobbles up the San Diego mindshare. Of course, there are many other reasons. Longevity is important. Population explosions don't have the legacy businesses. IMO, your HQ POV and trying to correlate it to a single variable (weather) is a flawed argument.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valley Native
Data centers generally offer lower pay than the actual HQs or corporate offices.
The highest-paid jobs are not had by people who are working for someone. It's (often) gained by people working for themselves. When I left Honeywell, within 3 years, I made more than my bosses, bosses, bosses, bosses, bosses boss. As in, the guy who had 10,000 employees working underneath him. I had three employees: me, myself, and I.
Therefore, don't put too much stock in HQ's and high income. HQ's are important. However, smaller companies (with higher growth) offer a lot of income potential. Keeping it real, plenty of small businesses also fail.
Last edited by MN-Born-n-Raised; 04-01-2024 at 06:36 AM..
Phoenix is hot as hell compared to anywhere in Texas. Even with humidity Phoenix is still hotter. Humidity is one factor but what about the effect of being in the FULL SUN during 110+ temps. That is way worse than 93 with humidity. The sun is so intense I remember that it will bleach anything left on the ground outside. You will burn your feet just going to check the mail without shoes. I remember that Temps in Phoenix can be 100 degrees even at 10:00pm.
Humidity though it can be miserable also will protect you from the sun. Houston gets regular rain with a cool off afterwards in July and August.
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Originally Posted by tijlover
But we're mainly talking temperature, not heat and humidity and the feel effect. In comparison to Houston in the summer time, Phoenix would appear "cooler".
With 110 degrees in summer with low humidity, you shave off 10+ degrees for the feel effect. With Humidity you add 10+ degrees for the feel effect.
Phoenix is hot as hell compared to anywhere in Texas. Even with humidity Phoenix is still hotter. Humidity is one factor but what about the effect of being in the FULL SUN during 110+ temps. That is way worse than 93 with humidity. The sun is so intense I remember that it will bleach anything left on the ground outside. You will burn your feet just going to check the mail without shoes. I remember that Temps in Phoenix can be 100 degrees even at 10:00pm.
Humidity though it can be miserable also will protect you from the sun. Houston gets regular rain with a cool off afterwards in July and August.
It depends on the person as it is subjective. And by definition, "dry heat" for me is much more palatable than a hot and humid climate. Our whole family sweats a lot which comes from my mom's side. It's genetic. There is no way I'm going to spend a summer in TX.
When I'm outside, I can escape the direct sun by sitting in the shade. I cannot in a highly ranked humid state like TX. https://todayshomeowner.com/moving/g...-humid-cities/ Since I sweat a lot, and in the 2nd driest city in America, I predict my sweat evaporates in the dry heat and I feel a lot cooler than most. As they say, YMMV.
It depends on the person as it is subjective. And by definition, "dry heat" for me is much more palatable than a hot and humid climate. Our whole family sweats a lot which comes from my mom's side. It's genetic. There is no way I'm going to spend a summer in TX.
When I'm outside, I can escape the direct sun by sitting in the shade. I cannot in a highly ranked humid state like TX. https://todayshomeowner.com/moving/g...-humid-cities/ Since I sweat a lot, and in the 2nd driest city in America, I predict my sweat evaporates in the dry heat and I feel a lot cooler than most. As they say, YMMV.
Is that year round humidity? Year round humidity doesn't matter. Summer humidity is what counts. I don't think phoenix is the second driest summer city out there.
I kind of like winter humidity. It feels like a cool blanket to me. It feels good as long as there isn't much wind.
Summer humidity feels like someone put a wool sweater over me. It feels terrible.
People are so short sighted. It seems they forget that there are 12 months in a year. The media only seems to focus on the Summer Heat and ignores the other 8 months a year that are pleasant. I rarely hear about how freezing cold Chicago or New York are in the winter on these forums.
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Originally Posted by dontbelievehim
Is that year round humidity? Year round humidity doesn't matter. Summer humidity is what counts. I don't think phoenix is the second driest summer city out there.
I kind of like winter humidity. It feels like a cool blanket to me. It feels good as long as there isn't much wind.
Summer humidity feels like someone put a wool sweater over me. It feels terrible.
Is that year round humidity? Year round humidity doesn't matter. Summer humidity is what counts. I don't think phoenix is the second driest summer city out there.
Look at the humidity graph by month of Brownsville, TX https://weatherspark.com/y/7911/Aver...tes-Year-Round (I would have linked City-data.com but they didn't give the monthly percentages.) It's fricking muggy during the summer. Not too bad during the winter months.
Phoenix is hot as hell compared to anywhere in Texas. Even with humidity Phoenix is still hotter. Humidity is one factor but what about the effect of being in the FULL SUN during 110+ temps. That is way worse than 93 with humidity. The sun is so intense I remember that it will bleach anything left on the ground outside. You will burn your feet just going to check the mail without shoes. I remember that Temps in Phoenix can be 100 degrees even at 10:00pm.
Humidity though it can be miserable also will protect you from the sun. Houston gets regular rain with a cool off afterwards in July and August.
I'd argue that standing in the direct sun at 115 with 12% humidity compared to standing in the direct sun at 93 with 90% humidity would be a wash. Since I hate humidity, 115 wins. That's just me, other folks may be different.
I'd argue that standing in the direct sun at 115 with 12% humidity compared to standing in the direct sun at 93 with 90% humidity would be a wash. Since I hate humidity, 115 wins. That's just me, other folks may be different.
Sure, but in TX, "at least you can go to the mailbox with your bare feet!" It's as if people who moved out are busy rationalizing why they left.
As you said, it's subjective. I know a few people that LOVE the hot and humid weather! Same with the 100+ degree, low humidity PHX temps: they brag how much they love it. Yea, for 99% of the people, it's fricken blazing HOT in the PHX desert! Some can adapt, others cannot. Just as for some, people despise the TX humidity. TX humidity is often talked about on C-D https://www.city-data.com/forum/texa...t-weather.html
Sure, but in TX, "at least you can go to the mailbox with your bare feet!" It's as if people who moved out are busy rationalizing why they left.
As you said, it's subjective. I know a few people that LOVE the hot and humid weather! Same with the 100+ degree, low humidity PHX temps: they brag how much they love it. Yea, for 99% of the people, it's fricken blazing HOT in the PHX desert! Some can adapt, others cannot. Just as for some, people despise the TX humidity. TX humidity is often talked about on C-D https://www.city-data.com/forum/texa...t-weather.html
Agreed. We've lived in south Florida for the past 24 years. I don't know that I've ever gotten used to this humidity. We visited Phoenix twice in the last few years, both times in August. The first time, we experience a high of 109, and the second time, 115. I can't honestly say that it was more uncomfortable than Florida during the peak of hurricane season. I've experienced 100 degrees with 97% humidity, and let me tell you, it's not pleasant. As you said, it's very subjective.
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When I left Honeywell, within 3 years, I made more than my bosses, bosses, bosses, bosses, bosses boss. As in, the guy who had 10,000 employees working underneath him. I had three employees: me, myself, and I. 
Houston?
It's as if people who moved out are busy rationalizing why they left. 
Yea, for 99% of the people, it's fricken blazing HOT in the PHX desert! Some can adapt, others cannot. Just as for some, people despise the TX humidity. TX humidity is often talked about on C-D 
