San Antonio International Lands First Transatlantic Service (Houston, Dallas: houses, salaries)

[yadigggski]

If this route does well I don't see why a direct to London wouldn't be a possibility. Paris seems more like a stretch. It seems like AUS is biting off more than they can chew when it comes to LHR, so who knows, maybe SAT can nab one of those routes.

It still has a way to go, but SA as a whole doesn't get enough credit IMO. This city has come FAR in the past 10-15 years.

[RadiantBaby]

Originally Posted by yadigggski

If this route does well I don't see why a direct to London wouldn't be a possibility. Paris seems more like a stretch. It seems like AUS is biting off more than they can chew when it comes to LHR, so who knows, maybe SAT can nab one of those routes.

It still has a way to go, but SA as a whole doesn't get enough credit IMO. This city has come FAR in the past 10-15 years.

San Antonio is woefully behind. They never saw the forest for the trees when they should have and are now steamrolled by the other big three Texas cities.

But, I digress...

The airliner term you're looking for is nonstop, not direct.

Would love to see LHR/LGW and CDG, but no legacy airlines are going to run thst route out of a city that's just been called one of the poorest for its size. Carriers need to see dollar signs, which is precisely why AA pulled their nonstops to JFK. The customer just wasn't there.

[yadigggski]

Originally Posted by RadiantBaby

San Antonio is woefully behind. They never saw the forest for the trees when they should have and are now steamrolled by the other big three Texas cities.

But, I digress...

The airliner term you're looking for is nonstop, not direct.

Would love to see LHR/LGW and CDG, but no legacy airlines are going to run thst route out of a city that's just been called one of the poorest for its size. Carriers need to see dollar signs, which is precisely why AA pulled their nonstops to JFK. The customer just wasn't there.

Didn't Delta just add a JFK flight? The JetBlue JFK route is pretty new too. Maybe a Gatwick flight on a different carrier could happen, idk. I think Austin had a direct there a while ago and lost it. If the numbers are there maybe a BA flight to LHR is feasible, but AUS being so close adds a level of complication most cities don't have. I do agree that whatever the airport/city shot callers were doing 15-20 years ago set the city back. They should have been putting this energy into the airport back when AT&T was still around.

I've always seen SA as a tale of 2 cities in a lot of ways. They're building a 40k sqft Lamborghini dealership out by Fair Oaks (which absolutely stomps the puny one in Austin), Porsche just built a massive dealership on I-10, LV and Gucci standalones at La Cantera are a couple years old at most, new developments with giant houses going up left and right on the N/NW side, etc. There's obviously a market here for higher end things despite how it looks on paper. Miami is poor on paper too but that doesn't tell the full picture.

[Remington Steel]

Originally Posted by yadigggski

Didn't Delta just add a JFK flight? The JetBlue JFK route is pretty new too. Maybe a Gatwick flight on a different carrier could happen, idk. I think Austin had a direct there a while ago and lost it. If the numbers are there maybe a BA flight to LHR is feasible, but AUS being so close adds a level of complication most cities don't have. I do agree that whatever the airport/city shot callers were doing 15-20 years ago set the city back. They should have been putting this energy into the airport back when AT&T was still around.

I've always seen SA as a tale of 2 cities in a lot of ways. They're building a 40k sqft Lamborghini dealership out by Fair Oaks (which absolutely stomps the puny one in Austin), Porsche just built a massive dealership on I-10, LV and Gucci standalones at La Cantera are a couple years old at most, new developments with giant houses going up left and right on the N/NW side, etc. There's obviously a market here for higher end things despite how it looks on paper. Miami is poor on paper too but that doesn't tell the full picture.

It still baffles me that SA can "support" a huge Lamborghini & Porsche dealership....so there is hope. Maybe it has something to do with our close proximity to the Mexican states of Coahuila & Nuevo León which are known to have a lot of wealthy people.

[RadiantBaby]

Originally Posted by yadigggski

Didn't Delta just add a JFK flight? The JetBlue JFK route is pretty new too. Maybe a Gatwick flight on a different carrier could happen, idk. I think Austin had a direct there a while ago and lost it. If the numbers are there maybe a BA flight to LHR is feasible, but AUS being so close adds a level of complication most cities don't have. I do agree that whatever the airport/city shot callers were doing 15-20 years ago set the city back. They should have been putting this energy into the airport back when AT&T was still around.

I've always seen SA as a tale of 2 cities in a lot of ways. They're building a 40k sqft Lamborghini dealership out by Fair Oaks (which absolutely stomps the puny one in Austin), Porsche just built a massive dealership on I-10, LV and Gucci standalones at La Cantera are a couple years old at most, new developments with giant houses going up left and right on the N/NW side, etc. There's obviously a market here for higher end things despite how it looks on paper. Miami is poor on paper too but that doesn't tell the full picture.

DL did add JFK. That was a plus for DL flyers.

JB is about to discontinue SAT-JFK, as their numbers dropped dramatically when the partnership with AA was dissolved a couple of months back.

The Lambo dealership is centered squarely at getting Mex National business (and they will). It's not really for locals, considering the bubble who can afford them here is very, very small.

Porsche needed more service bays, so that was inevitable. Principle took forever to make that decision (10+ years). Also taken into consideration that Porsche's most popular model is also their cheapest: The Macan. You can get into one for as low as $57k. Since debuting in 2015, it's allowed a whole other contingent of drivers to afford a Porsche. Dealerships are slammed.

As for luxury goods shopping, we have nothing compared to Dallas (North Park and HPV) and Houston. La Cantera is a few decent stores, surrounded by low-end. They attract someone new (like Scotch & Soda), but they end up closing pretty soon thereafter. San Antonio simply doesn't yet have the constant capital to keep these brands alive and doing well.

LV will always attract people. I hate saying this, but look at who goes into their store. It's not the well-heeled. It's the people who are going into mass credit card debt to have that status symbol, plastic-coated canvas bag.

Bottom line, San Antonio is nowhere near where it should be and there's no real answer to how we get there from here. You can't just magically attract high paying salaried jobs into a city that used to a low hourly wage.

[hindsight2020]

hey now, the poors gotta live somewhere. This country has enough unaffordable metros as it is. Sometimes good enough IS good enough.

/stirpot

Jest aside, I've driven to IAH for my ocean crossing needs for over 12 years now. Heck, I used to do it when I was stuck in Del Rio, and that was double the drive. The convenience of a 30 minute drive is just not an inflection point when it comes to a once a year 1200-2000 dollar ocean-crossing city pair. For the Florida Man/Mickey Mouse stuff/ domestic tourism stuff sure, SAT suffices.

[StealthRabbit]

Originally Posted by Remington Steel

It still baffles me that SA can "support" a huge Lamborghini & Porsche dealership....so there is hope. Maybe it has something to do with our close proximity to the Mexican states of Coahuila & Nuevo León which are known to have a lot of wealthy people.

Those car customers don't seem to be flying 'commercial'.

I'm sure they MUST travel private charter (for various reasons).

Only Frankfurt makes sense from SAT to fill the seats to western Europe (due to military population)

I doubt SAT could fill a LHR flight

Maybe SAT could pick up a Guam or South Korea regular commercial flight.

[ged_782]

Originally Posted by StealthRabbit

Those car customers don't seem to be flying 'commercial'.

I'm sure they MUST travel private charter (for various reasons).

Only Frankfurt makes sense from SAT to fill the seats to western Europe (due to military population)

I doubt SAT could fill a LHR flight

Maybe SAT could pick up a Guam or South Korea regular commercial flight.

With SAT's two main air carrier runways at 8500', I don't think Guam or South Korea nonstop service is possible. London is certainly a possibility, though.

One of those two runways is slated to be extended out to 10,000', which will facilitate nonstop service to more intercontinental destinations. But, there still would have to be sufficient demand to make such flights economically viable. The failure of Air Canada service between San Antonio and Toronto just a few years ago still weighs on my mind. They couldn't fill those small Embraer jets, and pulled out when the subsidy ran out.

[RadiantBaby]

Originally Posted by StealthRabbit

Those carI'm sure they MUST travel private charter (for various reasons).

These aren't all PJ customers.

With leases, a lot of folks can get into a $150k+ vehicle.

Flying private is a whole other level of having money.

[RadiantBaby]

Originally Posted by ged_782

The failure of Air Canada service between San Antonio and Toronto just a few years ago still weighs on my mind. They couldn't fill those small Embraer jets, and pulled out when the subsidy ran out.

This right here. 100%.

SAT can offer as many incentives as they want, but once they run out, if the locals aren't taking the flights, the routes will evaporate.