Problem Students (private music lessons) (teachers, master, profession, grade)
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I love teaching--I really do. But here is a list of recent problem actions by students. Please note I teach private music lessons (violin/fiddle, viola & piano) from age four to older adults, and sometimes multiple children in a family. No particular order of importance:
1. Students trying to be in charge of the lesson, when they're totally lacking in knowledge about anything musical or pedagogical.
2. Quitting without the requested one month notice. Or worse: quitting on the day, even the hour, lesson fees are due.
3. Bringing some weird piece they picked up on the internet for an audition NEXT WEEK, with music that is far beyond their current technical ability.
4. Not picking up the toys before they leave.
5. Playing with my cat--who is in another part of the house and DOES NOT WANT TO BE BOTHERED, though he's very gentle and patient.
6. Making a lot of noise when they enter the studio, while another lesson is in progress.
7. Starting with some VSO ("Violin Shaped Object") that cannot be made to sound good or even stay in tune.
8. Children who clearly have some sort of learning disability but parents don't tell me.
9. Children who don't speak English and parents don't tell me.
Any other private studio teachers here?
All can, and indeed should, be addressed by a combination of a more through application for services (#8, 9, & 7), more clarity in your initial service contract between you and the parent (#2, 3, 4, 5, & 7), and a syllabus or statement of understanding between you and the student and/or parent if elementary age (#1, 3, 4, 5, & 6). Number 1 is the bane of every teacher who has tried to teach a student who is, or perceives themselves as, gifted in an area. It is just the nature of the beast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraZetterberg153
No, I didn't say I was having problems with discipline. That's just your interpretation. What I said is "here is a list of recent problem actions by students." And only another private teacher should respond, not someone who is unfamiliar with the profession.
I try to avoid (not always successfully, I'm sure) talking down to people, or offering tons of unwanted and off-topic advice in subject areas with which I have little or no familiarity.
Any tutor has had to deal with problems similar or along the lines that you have. What you described are discipline problems simply because any time students don’t do what a teacher wants it is by definition a discipline problem. The question is whether or not it is just a minor annoyance that is of little matter or an issue that needs to be addressed because it interferes with learning or is of enough annoyance to the teacher that it interferes with the teaching atmosphere.
You asked your question on a general teaching board, we don’t have many non-academic teachers who post here. The chances that one of those posters will happen by to respond to you in a timely manner is slim. However, many academic teachers and coaches have encountered similar enough issues to give meaningful advice. But that aside, we occasionally get posters who specifically state “only blah, blah teachers respond” but parents and non-educators on here will chime in anyway and when the OP gets in a thither about it they have to be reminded it doesn’t work that way. Once something is posted everyone has the right to respond.
I personally don’t get why people put in that exclusion since I have always found getting a chance to look at a problem from an uninvolved parent’s perspective beneficial. It has in the past helped me not make assumptions that would have resulted making a humdinger of a mistake.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraZetterberg153
I try to avoid (not always successfully, I'm sure) talking down to people, .....
*cough*cough*
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
No, I didn't say I was having problems with discipline. That's just your interpretation. What I said is "here is a list of recent problem actions by students." And only another private teacher should respond, not someone who is unfamiliar with the profession.
I try to avoid (not always successfully, I'm sure) talking down to people, or offering tons of unwanted and off-topic advice in subject areas with which I have little or no familiarity.
One might wonder, then, why you post your comments, questions on a public forum, open to anyone to read and comment as they see fit (within TOS rules, of course). If you wanted responses only from other private music teachers, why would you not pose your questions on a forum, or some other venue intended specifically for and frequented by those involved in music education? Or at least indicate in your public posts your intention to ridicule, dismiss, or feign offense at comments from sources other than your music teacher peers?
I saw no reason to respond (from my perspective as a parent whose children got private music lessons) to your enumerated music student problems, because frankly, I was surprised that if you'd had much experience at all with teaching music lessons (and I'd assume from your prior posts that you did), you hadn't figured out ways to handle these issues. Surely these issues aren't limited to just the current generation of youngsters and their parents, kids have since day one tested the limits and did what they could get away with, there have always been cheapskate parents out to get what they could without paying, there have always been children with limited language skills ( which they learn at breakneck speed given the chance). It's hard for me to understand why, if you have been teaching since 1962, you don't already have listed policies in place, and your studio (and waiting areas) set up to minimize these issues, and can just handle problems with individual students as they come up.
Unless you just wanted to kvetch and ridicule, or find offense in the "nonprofessional" contributions on a public forum.
I am or was a private and public school music teacher. I wasn't going to respond, but since you have so many negative posts, I'll give it a shot.
I had a cat too, but he was a "scardey cat" so he would run under the bed and wouldn't come out until it was all clear. He also HATED the noise from the music. I think it hurt his ears (mine too sometimes ). Can you put your cat in a room with a litter box during lessons or will he/she cry and scratch on the door?
I only had a few piano students come to my home. Most of the time, I went to the kids' home so I didn't have the problem with students arriving late for their lessons. At the time, I knew the kids from the neighborhood or from the school district where I worked so they didn't dare stiff me. I trusted them so on the rare occasion they couldn't pay, I trusted them to pay me next time. However, I have noticed that more and more teachers now are requiring parents to pay one month in advance and then using the system that you have with make-up lessons. But your circumstances are different. You get students whose parents work at a local college and many of them are foreign. It's not just the language barrier, it's the cultural differences. I used to teach a lot of Russian kids and don't get me started . I learned how to count up to 10 in about 15 different languages. You end up singing a lot of the parts and using rhythmic syllables (ta, ti-ti). You won't be able to use analogies until the kids get a better grasp of English so you'll have to depend on imitation for a while.
Obviously, you can't have the students use a "weird" piece for an audition. Is it some sort of pop tune that they want to play? I always warn them that the sheet music for these songs are not going to sound anything like they do on the CD or mp3 file. Sometimes, if possible, I'd take the piece that they give me and try to write a simplified arrangement or part of the song. If you can pull out the main theme of the song, perhaps you could use this opportunity to teach your students something about composition and have them either improvise or have the student write some sort of theme and variations or an original B section to go with the piece. Take this opportunity to encourage them into becoming more engaged and interested in music.
As far as instrument quality, they are probably renting their instruments or getting them from some family member or friend and they are in poor condition. Quality instruments are very expensive so this understandable, especially when you don't know if your kid is going to continue studying this particular instrument. I always kept a supply of old stuff and odds and ends and if I could, I would spend part of the lesson time repairing their horn or patching it so that we could proceed with the lesson. It would have to be a quick fix though, otherwise I'd refer them to a real repair center.
All you can do is talk to the parents, but as I mentioned previously, sometimes there are cultural barriers, so you shouldn't have high expectations for changes.
Kara, I just want to applaud you for still teaching all of this time. In our very youth-oriented society, one of the few areas where you can continue until you drop is classical music. The very young prodigies might be admired, but it takes years and years before musicians reach their peak. My kid took lessons from a very prestigious musician when he was 89 and got to play on an instrument owned by one of America's most beloved and esteemed composers. It was an amazing learning experience, cut short only by the teacher's death. Keep on going.
I am or was a private and public school music teacher. I wasn't going to respond, but since you have so many negative posts, I'll give it a shot.
I had a cat too, but he was a "scardey cat" so he would run under the bed and wouldn't come out until it was all clear. He also HATED the noise from the music. I think it hurt his ears (mine too sometimes ). Can you put your cat in a room with a litter box during lessons or will he/she cry and scratch on the door?
I only had a few piano students come to my home. Most of the time, I went to the kids' home so I didn't have the problem with students arriving late for their lessons. At the time, I knew the kids from the neighborhood or from the school district where I worked so they didn't dare stiff me. I trusted them so on the rare occasion they couldn't pay, I trusted them to pay me next time. However, I have noticed that more and more teachers now are requiring parents to pay one month in advance and then using the system that you have with make-up lessons. But your circumstances are different. You get students whose parents work at a local college and many of them are foreign. It's not just the language barrier, it's the cultural differences. I used to teach a lot of Russian kids and don't get me started . I learned how to count up to 10 in about 15 different languages. You end up singing a lot of the parts and using rhythmic syllables (ta, ti-ti). You won't be able to use analogies until the kids get a better grasp of English so you'll have to depend on imitation for a while.
Obviously, you can't have the students use a "weird" piece for an audition. Is it some sort of pop tune that they want to play? I always warn them that the sheet music for these songs are not going to sound anything like they do on the CD or mp3 file. Sometimes, if possible, I'd take the piece that they give me and try to write a simplified arrangement or part of the song. If you can pull out the main theme of the song, perhaps you could use this opportunity to teach your students something about composition and have them either improvise or have the student write some sort of theme and variations or an original B section to go with the piece. Take this opportunity to encourage them into becoming more engaged and interested in music.
As far as instrument quality, they are probably renting their instruments or getting them from some family member or friend and they are in poor condition. Quality instruments are very expensive so this understandable, especially when you don't know if your kid is going to continue studying this particular instrument. I always kept a supply of old stuff and odds and ends and if I could, I would spend part of the lesson time repairing their horn or patching it so that we could proceed with the lesson. It would have to be a quick fix though, otherwise I'd refer them to a real repair center.
All you can do is talk to the parents, but as I mentioned previously, sometimes there are cultural barriers, so you shouldn't have high expectations for changes.
Thank you for your response. I'm still recovering from being called a non-academic teacher. Along with private students I teach music theory, music history and pedagogy. All academic subjects last time I looked. And I have three published works on string pedagogy for sale on Amazon which are occasionally required texts in university pedagogy courses.
Regarding instruments, I have been selling them for, it was 20 years last year, both locally and online. We also have contracts with public schools in most states.
Kara, I just want to applaud you for still teaching all of this time. In our very youth-oriented society, one of the few areas where you can continue until you drop is classical music. The very young prodigies might be admired, but it takes years and years before musicians reach their peak. My kid took lessons from a very prestigious musician when he was 89 and got to play on an instrument owned by one of America's most beloved and esteemed composers. It was an amazing learning experience, cut short only by the teacher's death. Keep on going.
Thank you. Very sweet of you. My first violin teacher was a Romanian whom I worked with for six years and he was in his 80's, also. He came to Kansas in a covered wagon! And was a luthier, repairing instruments and rehairing bows. He put me through the standard repertoire--Wohlfahrt, Kayser, Mazas, Flesch, Kreutzer Sevcik--but also played fiddle for dances.
The musical life is a really good life, I've worked awfully hard and had a lot of great experiences I would not have had otherwise, including studying with some very eminent teachers.
Thank you for your response. I'm still recovering from being called a non-academic teacher. Along with private students I teach music theory, music history and pedagogy. All academic subjects last time I looked. And I have three published works on string pedagogy for sale on Amazon which are occasionally required texts in university pedagogy courses.
Regarding instruments, I have been selling them for, it was 20 years last year, both locally and online. We also have contracts with public schools in most states.
Academic instruction: in relationship to schools, colleges, and universities, especially work that involves studying and reasoning rather than practical or technical skills.
You said you worked privately one-on-one with students - meaning you are not instructing in a school, college, or university. You used the terms studio and home to describe the place you dispense instruction, not classroom or school. I was under the impression you only wanted responses from others who were also privately affiliated. It was not terminology just flung out to offend you or other independent educators, it was terminology accurately used based on your description.
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
One might wonder, then, why you post your comments, questions on a public forum, open to anyone to read and comment as they see fit (within TOS rules, of course). If you wanted responses only from other private music teachers, why would you not pose your questions on a forum, or some other venue intended specifically for and frequented by those involved in music education? Or at least indicate in your public posts your intention to ridicule, dismiss, or feign offense at comments from sources other than your music teacher peers?
I saw no reason to respond (from my perspective as a parent whose children got private music lessons) to your enumerated music student problems, because frankly, I was surprised that if you'd had much experience at all with teaching music lessons (and I'd assume from your prior posts that you did), you hadn't figured out ways to handle these issues. Surely these issues aren't limited to just the current generation of youngsters and their parents, kids have since day one tested the limits and did what they could get away with, there have always been cheapskate parents out to get what they could without paying, there have always been children with limited language skills ( which they learn at breakneck speed given the chance). It's hard for me to understand why, if you have been teaching since 1962, you don't already have listed policies in place, and your studio (and waiting areas) set up to minimize these issues, and can just handle problems with individual students as they come up.
Unless you just wanted to kvetch and ridicule, or find offense in the "nonprofessional" contributions on a public forum.
You always, always, always do this--pile on negativity, make hurtful, hypercritical remarks and cut the OP to ribbons. I have to wonder why. What is your motivation. Are you enjoying yourself when you do this?
You always, always, always do this--pile on negativity, make hurtful, hypercritical remarks and cut the OP to ribbons. I have to wonder why. What is your motivation. Are you enjoying yourself when you do this?
Travelassie summed up what several of the posters here are saying. You haven't answered some of the questions she and others have raised. How could the students be poorly behaved, running around your house, if a parent is present at every lesson? How could a simple issue of needing to be informed of a child's level of English mastery, or lack of English knowledge, prior to beginning the lessons, go unresolved for years? Many of the concerns you raise aren't difficult to address and resolve. Maybe there's more to these scenarios, than you've told us. If that's the case, by all means, provide more information.
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). Can you put your cat in a room with a litter box during lessons or will he/she cry and scratch on the door?
