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Housing is definitely the biggest factor in the affordability of Vermont. There are so many second homes bought by people who do not live in Vermont full-time and make so much more money than the average Vermonter, that they have driven-up housing prices beyond what many can afford. Property taxes are similarly onerous. Vermont has the highest personal state income tax rate in the country at 9.5%, which when added to Federal rates, pushes Vermont to the breath-taking rate of 44.5%, only .2% less than California. Adding in other state taxes, Vermont ranks sixth in the nation. Expect 11.10% of your income to go to the state of Vermont in one form or another. That was 2006. Per the Tax Foundation, as of April 4 of this year, Vermont has the highest tax burden in 2007, as Vermont taxpayers will see 14.1 percent of their income taken by state-local taxes. Alaska taxpayers, on the other hand, have the nation's lowest state-local burden; they will pay just 6.6 percent of their income in state-local taxes. (http://www.taxfoundation.org/news/show/22323.html - broken link)
Renting won't help either. The median assessed value is 1.6% of house value, making Vermont rank fourth in the nation for highest assessments and third for property taxes as a percentage of income.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arel
Jason Els, how can you not be dependent on Vermont's economy? If you are independently wealthy, I can see that. But how else can you not be dependent on Vermont's economy? Work in New Hampshire or Massachusetts? Have a variety of income streams, e.g. job, side busines(es) or second job(s), paying tenants and maybe, if you are lucky, investment income ( ). If I left anything out, please let me know. I welcome all suggestions.
You be a merchant with sales that do not depend on the Vermont market. Online businesses can be managed from anywhere (hint, hint).
How is the Vermont economy for social workers? Specifically, clinical social workers? I have been told by two Brattleboro therapists, both in private practice, that a therapist can make a decent living there.
Actuallly there may be less competition for social work jobs in a rural area like Vermont than in a big city. I just worry about the pay.
That's a good question and I don't know for sure. I'll ask my sister about it. She works for the state as a public guardian and prior to that worked for the mental health system of a rural county. Given some of the unbelievable things she encountered working in the Northeast Kingdom, she started carrying a gun and frequently needed police escorts to get her job done. As I've mentioned, there are parts of Vermont where people live in another time entirely. Family rape and incest, child marriage, locking crazy cousin Larry in the basement, pederasty, treating those with CP as idiots, refusing any and all healthcare from those outside the community, and a host of other things were what she dealt with on a daily basis. She essentially lived in Deliverance Land. She gained the trust of some people but not most. These people want nothing more than to be let alone and the state largely obliges. Some live without electricity, hot water, central heat, telephones, and other conveniences and it's not uncommon to find a house without one or any of those things. Vermont is not an idyllic Shangri-La nestled away waiting to be discovered. It is largely rural and middle class with large areas of poverty and very small islands of prosperity here and there. What tourists usually see are those islands located along Route 7 and in the ski areas and it gives them the misbegotten idea that Larry, Darryl, and Darryl were just a Hollywood joke; that Vermont doesn't have some serious problems. It all looks so quiet and pastoral and beautiful from the windows of your BMW's comfy heated leather seats. This is a large reason the flatlanders have poured in to the Burlington, Brattleboro, and ski areas.
Vermont is something like New York city in these respects. There are areas of great wealth, middle class communities outlying those wealthy areas, and then some large pockets of tremendous poverty and backwardness but it's all on a rural scale, not an urban one. Church street may as well be Fifth Avenue to the average rural Vermonter.
I have lived in Vermont all of my life and have never once worn a pair of Carharts. Neither have I worn Dickies.
I never heard of anyone painting on someone's fur coat..I knew one woman who had a real fur and no one gave her any problems about it. She was from another country and she froze all winter. We got a kick out of her tiny form swathed in thick fur.
Everyone seems to see Vermonters as either hicks or hippies. Truth is we are basically a normal bunch of people, in general. This isn't deep appalachia or cambridge, mass!
After having lived many years in the Canadian system (34 years) people in VT or anywhere in the US have not seen a tax burden. But that is another story for another time.
I currently live in MI but it looks pretty good that the job I interviewed for will come through. With that in mind my wife and I have been looking at property and VT has nothing on those costs compared to any decent places in MI. The reason property taxes and housing prices in MI and many other states appear lower on the national scale is that the larger cities with their poverty and crime bring the average done. Get into the suburban areas where we are at and you will wish for VT taxes.
As for gasoline when I was in the Burlington and Johnson areas a couple of weeks ago the prices were exactly on with what we were paying in MI.
Wish me luck as my wife and I would both love to relocate to VT. I grew up in rural New Brunswick (Canada) and love the rural life. My wife grew up in rural MI, so I hope that we would fit in.
With politics I am left on some items and hard right on others....sounds like it might work after all. Thanks for listening.
After having lived many years in the Canadian system (34 years) people in VT or anywhere in the US have not seen a tax burden. But that is another story for another time.
I currently live in MI but it looks pretty good that the job I interviewed for will come through. With that in mind my wife and I have been looking at property and VT has nothing on those costs compared to any decent places in MI. The reason property taxes and housing prices in MI and many other states appear lower on the national scale is that the larger cities with their poverty and crime bring the average done. Get into the suburban areas where we are at and you will wish for VT taxes.
Rubbish!
Americans pay just as much as Canada or Europe and even both. We just don't pay them to the same place, at the same time, and guess what? We don't get nearly as much for what we pay.
We PAY a great deal and receive relatively less. Our highest federal tax bracket is 35%. Canada's is 36.1%. Corporate income tax is the same. Canada's VAT is 7%. Ours can range from none to 8.75%. Further, we pay road taxes on our cars, added taxes for our gas and local income and property taxes which can range from none to nearly 20% of income. That's on top of the 35%.
And we still have to pay for our own health care and pension. The former of which can bankrupt even a wealthy person in no time.
Great post! Thanks for sharing this with us.
The perspective of Candians is always fascinating to me - In my experience, Quebecers are quick to point out that they'd trade tax burdens with Vermonters any day of the week...And I find Quebec an extremely congenial place...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ab8mi
After having lived many years in the Canadian system (34 years) people in VT or anywhere in the US have not seen a tax burden. But that is another story for another time.
I currently live in MI but it looks pretty good that the job I interviewed for will come through. With that in mind my wife and I have been looking at property and VT has nothing on those costs compared to any decent places in MI. The reason property taxes and housing prices in MI and many other states appear lower on the national scale is that the larger cities with their poverty and crime bring the average done. Get into the suburban areas where we are at and you will wish for VT taxes.
As for gasoline when I was in the Burlington and Johnson areas a couple of weeks ago the prices were exactly on with what we were paying in MI.
Wish me luck as my wife and I would both love to relocate to VT. I grew up in rural New Brunswick (Canada) and love the rural life. My wife grew up in rural MI, so I hope that we would fit in.
With politics I am left on some items and hard right on others....sounds like it might work after all. Thanks for listening.
I have lived in Vermont all of my life and have never once worn a pair of Carharts. Neither have I worn Dickies.
I never heard of anyone painting on someone's fur coat..I knew one woman who had a real fur and no one gave her any problems about it. She was from another country and she froze all winter. We got a kick out of her tiny form swathed in thick fur.
Everyone seems to see Vermonters as either hicks or hippies. Truth is we are basically a normal bunch of people, in general. This isn't deep appalachia or cambridge, mass!
I for 1 have noticed alot of carhart in VT and I am there 2 or 3 times a week. But I do see what your saying. There are people who don't wear such. And I will say that those who do are normally workers. Not Wearing them to make a fashion statement. They wear them because they are good work cloths, and comfortable at the same time. As I said they are the new Dickie's. Back in the 70 and 80's Dickie was the Market for work gear. Now it is Carhart. I wear them Myself because they are tough, and comfortable. 1 Pair will last me 2 years. Where as 1 pair of wrangler, or Levi silver tab, will only give me a year in the field, before they are garbage. Work hard, Play hard, have fun, Carhart fits them all. LOL And No we don't think they are all hicks. 80% Tree huggers Yes but hicks NO.
Jason sorry to disagree but I lived the system, and you only quoted the federal income tax rate not the provinces or all of the other taxes and by the way the sales tax in most provinces is 15 % or more with the exception of Alberta. Add the money they take out for Medicare and Canada Pension, much higher gas taxes.....sigh on and on and a crap medical system to boot. My mom has been waiting 6 months for an MRI. Yes every one has medical...equally poor medicine. Food costs are also generally higher especially in the Atlantic region. Car prices are about 30 to 40 % higher and right now the dollar isn't that bad. Wow...shakes my head and moves on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason_Els
Rubbish!
Americans pay just as much as Canada or Europe and even both. We just don't pay them to the same place, at the same time, and guess what? We don't get nearly as much for what we pay.
We PAY a great deal and receive relatively less. Our highest federal tax bracket is 35%. Canada's is 36.1%. Corporate income tax is the same. Canada's VAT is 7%. Ours can range from none to 8.75%. Further, we pay road taxes on our cars, added taxes for our gas and local income and property taxes which can range from none to nearly 20% of income. That's on top of the 35%.
And we still have to pay for our own health care and pension. The former of which can bankrupt even a wealthy person in no time.
It is difficult to find dressy shoes that are flat.[/quote]
i disagree with tht quote. now there ar new shoes called "flats" (it may helo if u read a fashion magazine) they come in all styles dressy and casual.
i have to say i agree with most peoples appinion. vermont IS RELAXED about fashion. we dont realy care. but there IS FASHION in vermont. it is not stupid to spend 300$ on a good purse. i mean it will last longer than any old department store purse, its in style, and it complements any outfit. also high heels in vermont are everywear. it may be becuz im young and wen ur young fashion is something thats inportant. people DO judge by clothes. also i have 2 say tht i am a freqent shopper at hollister ,and american eagal, A+F areopostal, ralph lauren, and pac sun. those are mazing stores. people do say if u wear DEPARTMENT store tht it is ugly. i mean its cheap, ugly (again), poor quality, and u cna only wear it 4 lik a week. wats up with that?
so in a way vermont is relaxed. it is not lik nyc ( i would love 2 liv there becuz of fashion), but it does judge.
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Fashion in vermont
