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I can't call a climate with all months under 18°C subtropical, it feels just as wrong as calling Erie, PA subtropical which has it's coldest month around -2°C
I guess it depends how you look at it. To me Manizales is solidly subtropical as it shows the same pattern as tropical-equatorial climates, just cooler in all seasons due to altitude. If I were creating a subtropical category I'd want it to border the tropical at altitude as well as latitude so having Pueblo Rico (tropical) bordering Manizales (not-even-subtropical) is a problem.
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Originally Posted by Bisfbath
I guess it depends how you look at it. To me Manizales is solidly subtropical as it shows the same pattern as tropical-equatorial climates, just cooler in all seasons due to altitude. If I were creating a subtropical category I'd want it to border the tropical at altitude as well as latitude so having Pueblo Rico (tropical) bordering Manizales (not-even-subtropical) is a problem.
The only fix I could think of is to change the cold month for subtropical and warm oceanic climates to 6°C to 16°C, then make a tropical transitional category where all months are over 16°C, and the warmest month is below 24°C. Then split tropical climates into seasonal and equatorial.
Have seasonal tropical be coolest month 16°C+ with warmest month 24°C+, and equatorial tropical have all months 24°C+
That would make both Pueblo Rico and Manizales tropical transitional
The only fix I could think of is to change the cold month for subtropical and warm oceanic climates to 6°C to 16°C, then make a tropical transitional category where all months are over 16°C, and the warmest month is below 24°C. Then split tropical climates into seasonal and equatorial.
Have seasonal tropical be coolest month 16°C+ with warmest month 24°C+, and equatorial tropical have all months 24°C+
That would make both Pueblo Rico and Manizales tropical transitional
Personally it’s the dividing line in real feel temperature with humidity. Below 65 F, humid days feel colder than the actual temperature. Above it, humid days feel warmer than the actual temperature. For example, 50 F and humid feels more like 45 F, while 80 F and humid feels more like 85 F.
When I was in college in the late 80s, I read this in an old meteorology book (probably from the 50s or 60s) that I found in the college library. If I remember correctly, what Koppen did was noted where coconut palms "naturally" grew and found that their climatic limit was to places that didn't have any monthly average temperatures below 18C or 64.4F. The book also explained that this was why an A Koppen climate uses this temperature as the minimum monthly average for a tropical climate.
Now, you could say that the old book was wrong about Koppen but this was a scientific meteorology book, not one that you would find in a Barnes & Noble for the general public so I doubt that it was incorrect.
When I was in college in the late 80s, I read this in an old meteorology book (probably from the 50s or 60s) that I found in the college library. If I remember correctly, what Koppen did was noted where coconut palms "naturally" grew and found that their climatic limit was to places that didn't have any monthly average temperatures below 18C or 64.4F. The book also explained that this was why an A Koppen climate uses this temperature as the minimum monthly average for a tropical climate.
Now, you could say that the old book was wrong about Koppen but this was a scientific meteorology book, not one that you would find in a Barnes & Noble for the general public so I doubt that it was incorrect.
Interesting! I presume by "naturally" it meant able to reproduce by itself, which would make sense as coconut palms do grow in climates a little cooler than 18C in the coldest month, but probably don't naturalise.
Interesting! I presume by "naturally" it meant able to reproduce by itself, which would make sense as coconut palms do grow in climates a little cooler than 18C in the coldest month, but probably don't naturalise.
Yes, I believe that is what he meant, the palms could grow, set viable fruit, and establish themselves long-term without interference from humans.
Not really why, but 18C is also the threshold for the beginning/end of summer where I live. It's also the temperature at which I start wearing short sleeves.
I can't call a climate with all months under 18°C subtropical, it feels just as wrong as calling Erie, PA subtropical which has it's coldest month around -2°C
Let wikipedia kill you with the -3°C isotherm, Erie, PA is humid-subtropical, there you go man!!!
I consider 64.4°F to be the first practical cold temperature since I have to start my light sweater layer, and 26.6°F to the start of hard cold where you start to use extra layers and more than just simply a jacket and simple winter clothes. I use Köppen isotherms more seriously, 26.6-64.4°F(-3°C-18°C) is temperate isotherms as mild cold or simple cold, -36.4°F-26.6°F(-3°C- -38°C) very cold or hard cold, and -38°C or below extreme cold in which his system does. I take it so serious that when it is below 64.4°F(18°C) outside I start to wear jackets, when it is below 26.6°F outside I get packed up with 3 layers of clothes, and sweaters under the jackets seriously, and if it’s below -38°C outside I wouldn’t even go outside since it is very dangerous for me, and not even in Yakutsk I would adapt, and no winter clothes of no sort would help bro. No Dfd, Dwd, or Dsd climates for me, well I would visit just to try them out, but you know that the cold winters I would not be outside often.
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