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Old 02-23-2014, 05:48 PM
 
13,811 posts, read 27,443,172 times
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Old 02-23-2014, 06:30 PM
 
Location: kcmo
712 posts, read 2,145,792 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpenD View Post
To quote Manuel, from "Fawlty Towers... "Que?"
Healing.. works better than therapy!
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Old 02-23-2014, 06:56 PM
 
671 posts, read 854,063 times
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OP, your wife loves you and she doesn't want you to die. Small planes crash often- not like commercial aircraft. I know people who have lost relatives in small plane crashes.

I hate the idea of you not living your dream. Maybe ask her if she would go with you on a few classes or even simulation classes. At least under those situations the person flying will be an expert and she will feel safer.

I am sure that if she wanted to do something that freaked you out, you would ask her to change her mind and she would.

Good luck!
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:22 PM
 
4,749 posts, read 4,321,209 times
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Ask her if she'll agree to following: You'll increase your life insurance policy if she'll let you fly.

ETA: In all seriousness, it's not going to happen. Respect her wishes and whatever you do, DON'T DO IT BEHIND HER BACK!
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:23 PM
 
526 posts, read 898,597 times
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I am so much more frightened in the right hand seat of a car on freeway than in our plane! actually, the most frightening part of flying now is the road we have to take to airport


lst time I flew with my husband he was piloting a plane he had rebuilt. That was far too much trust to put in anyone (mechanical & flying abilities) -- then I realized he earned that trust

when I was a kid, a friend of my fathers died flying (my father was very boring & took no chances/fun). I recall my mother saying friend had "no right to fly when he had a wife & children" I always remembered that -- if you had a family/marriage that meant you were supposed to give up your "self"?

Last edited by eidas; 02-23-2014 at 07:32 PM..
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:51 PM
 
Location: Wyoming
9,724 posts, read 21,230,068 times
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I flew privately for just short of 30 years and right at 2000 hours logged. (Gave it up due to a combination of money and medical issues, plus I no longer had a "need" to fly.) I had many pilot friends who perished in their planes for various reasons.
1. One young gal, a friend of the family, walked into a spinning propeller.
2. High time instructor/charter pilot augured in while flying pipeline patrol (sharp bank at low speed/low altitude and stalled).
3. Non-instrument pilot (school teacher/businessman) tried flying in instrument conditions. He got about a mile.
4. Instrument pilot (police chief) set the wrong outbound radial on his nav. radio for a night flight and flew into a mountainside.
5. Commercial/instrument pilot flying in weather ended up inside a storm cloud and lost a wing.
6. Commercial/instrument pilot (wealthy oilman and father of the gal who walked into the spinning prop) crashed his helicopter (cause still undetermined).
7. High-time military chopper pilot/commercial pilot/instructor crashed his gyrocopter.
8. Private pilot hit a mountain top in the Black Hills during a night cross-country flight.

I'm sure there were more, and there were definitely more who crashed their planes but walked away. Small aircraft can be dangerous. The most danger comes during night flights and bad weather flights, both of which I did a lot of. I was (am) instrument rated and my plane was instrument certified, but problems that can normally be handled in good visibility conditions can become catastrophic when you can't see outside the cockpit.

If all you want to do is fly locally in good weather, flight in a small plane is pretty safe. It's when you start using it for traveling that it can become a little more risky -- flying at night, over/under low clouds, across mountains and large bodies of water, etc. I've had my share of pucker power "incidents" -- inadvertently flying into clouds at night before I had an instrument rating, inadvertently flying into thunderstorms after I had it, flying into moderate icing, building up carb ice, developing a severe oil leak on a night cross country, etc., etc.

Your wife's fears are not totally irrational. Still, there are risks in everything we do. We learn to manage the risks or die trying.

Last edited by WyoNewk; 02-23-2014 at 08:03 PM..
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Seattle
337 posts, read 494,702 times
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I started flying when I was 19 in a college aviation program and don't personally know anyone whom was killed in a general aviation accident. There were some emergency procedures, such as the time a high-time pilot and his four year-old son had to land with the gear up in a Piper Arrow because the gear would not come down, or the time a solo student somehow inverted his Cessna 152 right on take-off and landed upside-down on the wing, but no one actually got hurt during those incidents.

Now, I did do a cross-country flight with another young student on a winter day whom then decided to take off for a solo night flight in deteriorating VFR conditions and got stuck above a cloud layer, he had no choice but to descend through the clouds and he was in contact with ATC. Luckily, he had been going through some IFR training (though was not yet rated) so he survived the ordeal, but ATC and the school's director really yanked his chain something fierce. The flight school director was a former US Army helicopter pilot and instructor, the guy was no-nonsense and strict, very much the military warrant officer that he was, so you can imagine what this kid felt like afterward. Still, the pilot knew better and even I questioned him as to whether the conditions were good enough to make another cross-country flight that evening. He brushed me off, but all of the signs for a bad decision were there. So much of aviation comes down to judgement, and this is what your instructor will try very hard to instill in you.

Other than that, I can't really think of too many things which will aren't really recoverable as long as you are flying within the operating limits ("the envelope") of your aircraft. Regarding lessons, you won't be away for long bouts of time because most lessons are kept to about an hour along with some ground prep/briefing before the flight. My opinion is to start studying the FAA exam materials/take a course either before you start flying or immediately when you start so that you don't have to put your flying on hold until you pass the exam.

Tell your wife that you'll take up the sport of hang gliding instead - I prefer that now to flying powered aircraft because, well, it's just easier to do and less expensive. Glider cost me about $2,000, is storable/tranportable and don't have to pay for gas or other expenses. You can go from beginner to novice flyer in about two weeks of regular training. And honestly, it's just more fun.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:59 PM
 
Location: Saint Louis, MO
3,483 posts, read 9,015,001 times
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Several others on here have said it, and I'll reiterate...general aviation flying is not nearly as safe as commercial air travel. It's not as controlled, the personnel aren't as well trained, and the maintenance isn't as stringent...is it safer than driving? That'll depend on how you divvy up the statistics...This person did some of that for me, and it seems as solid as anything I can come up with:

  • driving: 1.32 fatal accidents and 1.47 fatalities per 100 million miles
  • airlines: .05 fatal accidents and 1.57 fatalities per 100 million miles
  • GA: 7.46 fatal accidents and 13.1 fatalities per 100 million miles
Accidents happen in everything we do, and you have to be realistic about the inherent risks associated with any activity. Flying isn't in and of itself dangerous, but it is terribly unforgiving. If you make the wrong decision, aviation will punish you for it. I've long said, there's no place for ego in a cockpit.


Now, I'd definitely talk to your wife about this...it's a major commitment of both time and money, and it sounds like your wife has very deep fear of aviation (warranted or not). You guys will want to discuss that and come to an agreement. If flying is really a passion that you have and something you need to do, then you're going to have to convey that to your wife. And sadly, if that passion is a MUST for you, then you're going to have a decision to make if she doesn't come on board.



My wife has never been a huge fan of flying. I took her for her first small airplane ride when I was a freshman in college and had just earned my private pilot certificate. Her mom would always say "Don't tell me if you two are flying to town, as I'll just worry all day". While my wife doesn't "mind" flying, it's not an activity she enjoys. At the same time, she's never objected to me doing it, in fact she's encouraged me to remain engaged in flying as much as I can to "scratch the itch". However much of that stems from me removing myself from professional flying for 4 years following a 3 year career at the airlines. She could tell I missed flying, and was ok with me spending a little money here or there on flights, and welcomed me getting back into some weekend instructing...much of this is likely a fear that if i missed it too much, i'd go back to the airlines.
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Old 02-23-2014, 10:01 PM
 
Location: Wyoming
9,724 posts, read 21,230,068 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polymorphist View Post
I started flying when I was 19 in a college aviation program and don't personally know anyone whom was killed in a general aviation accident....
How old are you, and how many active pilots do you know. The accidents I related in the post above were over a period of 40 years. I started flying at age 22. I was quite active in aviation and knew a lot of pilots, plus I've lived in the same community for 43 years now, so I've kept track of most of my pilot friends. Some have moved away, and of course I moved away from some too, from 43+ years ago. Time has a way of catching up with people's bad habits, be they flying, driving or whatever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flynavyj View Post
... My wife has never been a huge fan of flying....
My first wife was all in with me flying, as it made weekend trips to see her parents (700 miles away) quite possible. We'd normally leave work a little early on a Friday. In my Comanche it was a 3.25 hour trip headed east, about 3.75 headed back home on Sunday afternoon. (She'd sleep through most of it.) It also made shopping trips easy. We lived in a small city without much retail shopping, so we often flew to Billings for a day of shopping. To drive there it's 3.5 hours; to fly less than an hour. I'd call ahead and have a car awaiting us when we landed, so it was a snap. Denver is a 6 hour drive or 2 hours in the Comanche. My ex loved shopping and visiting her parents, so she liked the plane. I also used it for business, as I had investments across Wyoming and Montana that required a visit now and then. The plane made it possible to visit Cody, WY and Columbia Falls, MT in the same day and be home that night. Driving would have taken most of a (5-day) week!

My second wife had a horrible fear of flying (commercially) -- a crippling fear. She couldn't do it. She wanted to get over it, so she was willing to try in my plane. I told her I could stop until we were halfway down the runway, and after that I could circle around and land if she wanted me to. Knowing she had some control over the flight, she took to it like a duck to water. She loved, loved, loved flying in our plane. We'd fly somewhere just for breakfast, fly to fly-ins, fly to NYC (her hometown), etc. I'd been heavily involved in EAA, president of our local chapter for several years. She became even more involved as publicity chairman. Together we published a chapter newsletter, and it was so popular that we started publishing one for the Wyoming Pilot's Assn. (before her unexpected death).

OP, you might give some thought to what advantages your wife could enjoy with a pilot in the family. Sometimes a different slant is all it takes. Do keep in mind, it's not a cheap hobby, especially if you own your own plane and use it for longer trips.
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Old 02-24-2014, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Georgia
4,577 posts, read 5,662,523 times
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My dad always wanted to learn how to fly -- and when I started college, I was surprised and proud of him when he finally decided to do it. The class was difficult for him -- he was never a strong student, dropped out of college in the 50's to join the Navy, and I remember him as a young child when he was going to night school and struggling over algebra. However, he knew cars and he knew engines like nobody's business. I got weekly reports on his flying lessons, helped him with his classwork, and he was so proud when he finished with the highest grade in the class. He kept going to weekly lessons, and was thrilled when he started his solo flights. He was a careful flyer, very methodical, and we were looking forward to my summer break, when he would be able to carry me as a passenger.

Then . . . he quit. No explanations, except a lame, "I just don't have time for it." No amount of prodding would bring forth a solid reason.

My mother hadn't been crazy about the idea, but she knew it was important to him, so she kept quiet, beyond the initial expressions of concern. Even she was perplexed -- but relieved.

A few years later I asked him, "So why DID you stop flying . . . really?" He admitted that he had had an "incident" -- bad fuel, bad gas line, whatever -- that caused him to have to land the plane on a nearby country road. They got it fixed, no problem -- but at that point he checked his insurance and realized that he wasn't covered for recreational flying. And to GET covered would be a huge increase in premiums. He had just started a business, and my brother was still very young, so he made the decision that it didn't make sense, financially, to pursue flying. But at least he had had the chance to try it, and checked it off the bucket list. :-)
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