BEVs will never take over by 2035 (state, voted, million, percentage)
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So far as the law, the way I read it.. You just can't sell a new vehicle in CA after 2035 that isn't zero emission
Which.. Hybrids qualify. Hydrogen I would assume would qualify. But.. They say nothing about REGISTERING a vehicle. So.. People leave the state to buy. It becomes a road trip where you drive out to buy a new car and then have the road trip back home in the new vehicle.
Plus.. Who knows where we'll be in 2035. EV tech may have been replaced by the Next Big Thing.
Personally.. I think CA winds up delaying that. Probably due to electrical grid issues. The fact they changed the Net Metering rules on solar probably means that less and less people are going to be installing solar power.. and, if there start to be rolling blackouts.. Which.. Isn't a crazy thought.. Additionally. Many of the people who DO have solar, basically, anyone who put in solar prior to 2010.. Their systems will be due for replacement. With the new net metering and no subsidies (assuming).. Will they replace the system? Which.. Will put a bigger power crunch into play.
A problem is that this is driven by ideology, not environmental goals. Also, the people involved are simply not the “sharpest tool in the shed.“
Well, expensive vehicles (not EVs) are still selling like hotcakes...particularly gas guzzling BOF trucks and SUVs. Every other vehicle I see on the road is a new or year old Yukon Denali it seems.
It would be a mess. Trust me. I lived there for two years and used that garage.
Do you have any idea how much that would cost even if it were possible (it isn't) in my old garage? You think LA greedy landlords are gonna pay for that???
That's not going to happen for a very, very, very long time. If ever at all. Doubt it will even happen at all.
Re gas stations disappearing, it will be a long time. A super gas station place opened up about three years ago two miles from me, and a new one is being built even closer.
Re gas stations disappearing, it will be a long time. A super gas station place opened up about three years ago two miles from me, and a new one is being built even closer.
Lol of course it will, if ever. Gas stations aren't going anywhere.
A gas station opened up outside of town with 120 gas pumps, lol yes 120.
Re gas stations disappearing, it will be a long time. A super gas station place opened up about three years ago two miles from me, and a new one is being built even closer.
In my neck of the woods, a Sinclair station has been under construction for about three years. About one year ago Sinclair removed the signage. On the Hutchinson Parkway the Mobil, one of the most profitable in the country, went dark last September 13 and was supposed to reopen May 25. The pumps are gone and there is little sign of activity.
The thing I don't get is why none of the "green" politicians are addressing vehicle obesity in the US. It doesn't matter what the generation source is, if the average vehicle keeps increasing in size and weight like it is trending, the total environmental footprint for a 2050 car will be way worse than a 1990 one considering things like beefed up infrastructure need from weight, massive electrical grid overhaul, tire rubber emissions... We're literally going backwards environmentally with the 2025 vehicle lineup from where we were, trading our gasoline problem with a worse ginormous mineral / raw material extraction problem. Forget the vehicle resources, the infrastructure / grid revamp will require a TON of materials. All that extraction tears up habitat somewhere.
The natural transition between gas and full EV is obvious, it's plug in hybrids. That gets 60% of your total miles on an electric platform but bypasses the whole charging and range and battery resource limitation fiasco - just home charge and gas whatever isn't your little commute. There isn't crap out there for PHEV vehicles - there's more full EV offerings than there are plug ins!
PHEVs make much more sense with smaller vehicles, where you can have a small engine and small batteries so the dual system isn't too expensive or reliability concerning. For your typical obese SUV or Truck (which now sell in greater volumes than crossovers or sedans), being PHEV means you have to have both a massive ICE engine and a pretty massive battery / electric setup, so it doesn't make sense to double up.
By not addressing obesity, we're artificially jumping over the PHEV stage that would allow the natural transition. What we'll end up with is a flop of EVs that aren't truly usable and people defaulting back to straight ICE.
That will only apply to brand-new vehicles. People can still bring used cars in from other states, or keep driving a previously-bought car for the next 10 or 20 years. So even if this goes into effect in 2035, there will still be a lot of gas cars until 2050 at the earliest. That's plenty of time for homewoners and apartment complexes to add charging stations, if they start now!
That's true, and they don't have to "start now". It doesn't take that long to add charging stations, even DCFCs. The bigger problem remains core infrastructure-power generation, transmission and storage. And that isn't done by competitive, fast moving private companies. These are government regulated utilities. Moving at the speed of government-it is highly likely that neither will be complete in 1-2 decades.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P
The natural transition between gas and full EV is obvious, it's plug in hybrids. That gets 60% of your total miles on an electric platform but bypasses the whole charging and range and battery resource limitation fiasco - just home charge and gas whatever isn't your little commute. There isn't crap out there for PHEV vehicles - there's more full EV offerings than there are plug ins!
PHEVs make much more sense with smaller vehicles, where you can have a small engine and small batteries so the dual system isn't too expensive or reliability concerning. For your typical obese SUV or Truck (which now sell in greater volumes than crossovers or sedans), being PHEV means you have to have both a massive ICE engine and a pretty massive battery / electric setup, so it doesn't make sense to double up.
By not addressing obesity, we're artificially jumping over the PHEV stage that would allow the natural transition. What we'll end up with is a flop of EVs that aren't truly usable and people defaulting back to straight ICE.
The issue with PHEVs is that they are the worst of both worlds. All the weight, cost and complexity of an ICE vehicle, with a transmission, complex powertrain, emission, fuel, and ignition systems, etc. Along with the weight, cost and complexity of a BEV. Plus the complexity of making both systems play together. Now, companies have done a good job making these systems play together, but it doesn't change the fundamentals. At a time when batter supply is constrained and expensive, and DCFC infrastructure is still somewhat limited (especially in rural areas) I agree, it's a good bridge play.
The issue with PHEVs is that they are the worst of both worlds. All the weight, cost and complexity of an ICE vehicle, with a transmission, complex powertrain, emission, fuel, and ignition systems, etc. Along with the weight, cost and complexity of a BEV. Plus the complexity of making both systems play together. Now, companies have done a good job making these systems play together, but it doesn't change the fundamentals. At a time when batter supply is constrained and expensive, and DCFC infrastructure is still somewhat limited (especially in rural areas) I agree, it's a good bridge play.
Agreed, it's the most complex design and probably not a thing we'll see a lot in 40 years, hence why I brought up obesity. A PHEV sedan is something more manageable that could be sent out the door rather quickly compared to a PHEV SUV.
PHEVs make much more sense with smaller vehicles, where you can have a small engine and small batteries so the dual system isn't too expensive or reliability concerning. For your typical obese SUV or Truck (which now sell in greater volumes than crossovers or sedans), being PHEV means you have to have both a massive ICE engine and a pretty massive battery / electric setup, so it doesn't make sense to double up.
By not addressing obesity, we're artificially jumping over the PHEV stage that would allow the natural transition. What we'll end up with is a flop of EVs that aren't truly usable and people defaulting back to straight ICE.
That's already happening and it's getting worse.
People are buying the huge trucks because:
A. They generally have unmolested, powerful engines. Twin turbo downsized SUVs aren't my thing, but in said "obese" trucks they are potent and ICE only. And if you don't want that, there's still GM. I just picked up a 2022 Yukon Denali, the only treehugging thing it has is start/stop which is defeatable easily. The rest is just glorious V8 displacement and NA power. No hybrid, no electric motors, none of it.
B. Status symbols
C. They have become the new luxury sedans
D. Because the government tells us we shouldn't drive them
A. They generally have unmolested, powerful engines. Twin turbo downsized SUVs aren't my thing, but in said "obese" trucks they are potent and ICE only. And if you don't want that, there's still GM. I just picked up a 2022 Yukon Denali, the only treehugging thing it has is start/stop which is defeatable easily. The rest is just glorious V8 displacement and NA power. No hybrid, no electric motors, none of it.
B. Status symbols
C. They have become the new luxury sedans
D. Because the government tells us we shouldn't drive them
E. They don't want electric cars
D and E repeated several times over.
Which is ironic because it doesn't matter what engine you throw in Denali or truck, it will always drive like total crap because it's huge, heavy, and lifted high of the ground. Look at actual race cars - people that understand road feel go for a Porsche design, which is the exact opposite of the new obese "luxury" boxes.
If this is the new status symbol, America's palette has gone into the sewer, turning work vehicles into princess mobiles that still can't shed their boxy look. What's next, luxury schoolbuses and RVs???
Which is ironic because it doesn't matter what engine you throw in Denali or truck, it will always drive like total crap because it's huge, heavy, and lifted high of the ground. Look at actual race cars - people that understand road feel go for a Porsche design, which is the exact opposite of the new obese "luxury" boxes.
LOL. It's a Corvette engine ;-), slightly detuned and tinkered with. 420hp. Big SUVs drive better than ever, are you nuts?? I don't want a race car for point a to point b driving. I don't like small cars. I respect the beasts but I don't care about Porsches. You can't objectively say big SUVs don't drive well, you just personally don't like them. There is nothing better for cross country comfort and space.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P
If this is the new status symbol, America's palette has gone into the sewer, turning work vehicles into princess mobiles that still can't shed their boxy look. What's next, luxury schoolbuses and RVs???
That's your opinion. Trucks are more bad ass than ever. You should see how this Denali drives and feels.
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