People are leaving Massachusetts in droves. Who are they?

[newenglandgal123]

Originally Posted by justyouraveragetenant

They are not helping Americans only migrants. They don't help homeless vets but give the money to people who hate us. It will destroy Massachusetts and make it third world.

Have you seen some of our cities and towns lately? A good handful are already looking third world.


*You can get a third world vibe if you visit parts of any of the following.....Boston, Lawrence, Fall River, New Bedford, Methuen, Lowell, Worcester and the list goes on...

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade

The economic profile and class profile of the city changed, and the long-standing more diverse demographics came into power and came of age. That changed what the adults in the room thought and the lived experiences. Millennials run the city now. And a some Gen X.

Social issues began to dominate local politics more than nuts and bolts, all over America. A lot of that is due to the social upheavel of 9/11, the great recession, Donald trumps presidency, and the pandemic.

People also began to see more from other cities online and they could pick and choose what aspect they'd like tinsee in Boston and which ones they don't. The blinders came off.

A lot of “nirmal” townies didn't have the foresight tk see how they're voting decision. Would be their own downfall and they and their kids would get outbid by more skilled and wealthier people. And that the cities and neigh orgoods they'd fled had been filled with newcomers…

“The thing about the old days is…..they the old days “-Slim to Bodie on The Wire…

And these same starry eyed people "with their blinders off" who came in are now leaving. Go figure.

[AtkinsonDan]

Originally Posted by newenglandgal123

Have you seen some of our cities and towns lately? A good handful are already looking third world.

I am curious, which ones? Other than one trip to/from Logan, I haven't ventured south of the Andover to Salisbury stretch of I-495 since 2019.

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by msRB311

Which is also why i dont think these multi family buildings or whatever are going to help. Most people with a family want a SFH...not a condo or an apt. I'm not saying NO ONE wants this...but the majority do. They want a yard, etc. It may be that great boston, MA is no longer a place to achieve this for many unless they are willing to make adjustments.

I also think MA and people are super snobby about towns. People will leave if they can't get into a place like Hingham, Milton or Wellesley...before going to town like Hanover, Pembroke or Braintree. A lot of this has to do with schools but theres again some snobbery there. Kids aren't going to get a bad education in most MA towns...but people seem to have it in their head that they need to get their precious offspring into an A+ rated on niche school or theyve failed at life. this way of thinking needs to change.

Problem is MA has far too many 1 acre lot minimums.

In most places lof sizes for a SFH still allow you a yard but are much smaller.

There's an example in Illinois: https://maps.app.goo.gl/5U9iBtdBFhG9fvZQ8?g_st=ic

There's an example in North Carolina: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Hay8YSos74bFnD2T8?g_st=ic

There's one from Washington State: https://maps.app.goo.gl/66aLhFpdRgZJGzHy8?g_st=ic

There's an example in New Jersey: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Lud1N6hqiUdbfaQy9?g_st=ic

Bostons ultra low density suburbs like concord Dover Dover Hingham etc are too close to the city and the scarcity is a porblen

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade

Problem is MA has far too many 1 acre lot minimums.

In most places lof sizes for a SFH still allow you a lard but are much smaller.

There's an example in Illinois: https://maps.app.goo.gl/5U9iBtdBFhG9fvZQ8?g_st=ic

There's an example in North Carolina: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Hay8YSos74bFnD2T8?g_st=ic

There's one from Washington State: https://maps.app.goo.gl/66aLhFpdRgZJGzHy8?g_st=ic

There's an example in New Jersey: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Lud1N6hqiUdbfaQy9?g_st=ic

Bostons ultra low density suburbs like concord Dover Dover Hingham etc are too close to the city and the scarcity is a porblen

If the state actually funded infrastructure improvements like water, sewer, road upgrades and compensated for the cost of more students in the schools, I don't think resistance would be as strong. As it is now, suburban towns get punished for accommodating growth. Of course they are going to be against it.

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by charolastra00

Why not?

Where would you recommend that's less than an hour and a half from Boston during rush hour where you can buy a SFH or townhouse for under 600K? That's... Holbrook, Framingham, Randolph, Lynn, Dedham, Hyde Park. Maybe Quincy if you have the stomach for a bidding war. Maybe Norwood, Saugus, or Wakefield if you're willing to go very small (2 bed/1 bath or condo) or are willing to put in a lot of sweat equity.

Holbrook is better than Lynn or Hyde Park by miles.

I'd rather live in Hyde Park than Holbrook which just seems kinda trashy, dull, out of the way, and stagnant if not declining. Hyde Park has better transit, more vibrant, more on the upswing, closer to better shopping in Deham and downtown. Equidistant to Braintree and SSP.

A lot of the towns you listed are almost a little shabby, threadbare, or lacking desirable store and amenities in comparison to what you can get in other economically strong areas of the country for the same price point. That's why they're not popular. And they're far from the universities and tech areas where new comers to Eastern MA like to settle

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by massnative71

If the state actually funded infrastructure improvements like water, sewer, road upgrades and compensated for the cost of more students in the schools, I don't think resistance would be as strong. As it is now, suburban towns get punished for accommodating growth. Of course they are going to be against it.

Idk the townies would complain of traffic, construction detours, and it might necvesitate new taxes. Any thing regarding widescale change like that would face ire. Think about the towns that have refused annexation to Bostin or refused MBTA service from the state. People got mad the federal government finally made MA change their highway exits as they had been told to do 40 years ago.

I have zero faith in the new England town form of government or MMA to think clearly and get out of its own way in regards to development. Too inbred and myopic to not be and impediment, let alone be effective, in this space.

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by GeePee

Dedham also has very high taxes with little back in return.

Dedham has abundant shopping and entertainment relative to Holbrook. It also has elite private schools.

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by msRB311

Hard to understand how it got to this point all over the country. The only explanation is that everyone is moving as close as they can get to a city. It shouldn't be this way though.

Pretty clear how we got here

Rampant uncheck finacialization of our economy.

All normal folks wealth being hoarded into homes.

Rampant Exclusionary zoning.

more and more onerous safety and green energy regulations from federal and local levels.

Huge lot minimums.

NIMBYS.

Huge Baby Boomer generation sitting in homes making things difficult for younger buyers.

Divesting from public transportation in favor of highways.

[newenglandgal123]

Originally Posted by AtkinsonDan

I am curious, which ones? Other than one trip to/from Logan, I haven't ventured south of the Andover to Salisbury stretch of I-495 since 2019.

I updated my post to note some towns/cities above. You're lucky....it's better in NH. Other than Manchester and some sporadic pockets it's not to the level of how some of these MA locations look!