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Seems to me that I see that premise in a lot of posts. YMMV.
I don't see it either,; atheists do not do 'believe or not', nor 'everything is answerable by science' (both theistic strawmans(1) but perhaps your rather subtle point is that everything can be subjected to logic and evidence and it can be seen whether it makes the credibility -cut or not.
Bearing in mind that on the wire stuff has to be put in the pending -tray of 'Don't kow - yet' and that logically mandates not believing (The claim) until we know more.
In that respect your point that every question or claim can be logically resolved (believe, or not - yet) is sound. Including whether logic is valid. That gets questioned, too.
I think some people think activism atheism is what atheism is and that activism goal gets to decide the descriptors of the world around us.
I would actually say people that have a ax to grind against religion are less reliable than atheist that just don't care about religion. In terms of discussions on how the universe works and evaluating god claims anyway. Hard core activist, basically militants, have to have their way and their beliefs dominate.
Typically when believers cite Wikipedia as authority for anything, they are met with hoots and hisses. Sources such as the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy and the Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy are peer-reviewed and far more authoritative. Entries on atheism in such sources make clear that the proper definition of atheism is far more complex and nuanced than is suggested by the above.
Internet forum atheists, and the New Atheist movement in general, are attempting to redefine (or at least dumb down) the term atheist in order to make it more palatable and more broadly applicable and to give themselves certain pseudo-advantages in arguing with believers. It is not unlike homosexuals declaring they are gay, the gambling industry declaring it's really the gaming industry, and the abortion movement declaring it's really the pro-choice movement.
By the above definition, every agnostic is an atheist. Many thumb-sucking toddlers are atheists. Many people who have never give any thought to the existence of a deity are atheists.
In reality, and philosophically, an atheist is someone who has, at least at some level, given consideration to the possible existence of a deity and reached at least some level of conviction no deity exists. Atheism is not a mere "absence of belief." Absence of belief is agnosticism - or simply uninformed neutrality, if the individual has never considered the matter at all.
I can turn the above statements around and say I believe in God in EXACTLY the same way an atheist doesn't believe in God. I have an "absence of belief" in atheism. I have considered the evidence and arguments of all types and reached some level of conviction God exists (enough that I choose to live my life as though he does exist). A genuine atheist has done the same and reached some level of conviction no God exists. I can't prove God exists; the atheist can't prove God doesn't exist.
I don't believe in Zeus, Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny in EXACTLY the same way the atheist doesn't, and for the same reasons: I have considered the evidence and arguments and reached a conviction. When I reached an "absence of belief" in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny, I reached a corresponding positive belief that my parents were responsible for the presents and colored eggs.
The atheist doesn't hold his or her "absence of belief" in a vacuum. An absence of belief that we are God-created beings in a God-created reality, participating in a God-ordained plan, has ramifications for every aspect of the atheist's life. Atheism is a fundamentally different way of viewing oneself, one's fellow humans and other creatures, and the reality in which we exist. This fact can't be avoided by word games.
If the ostensible atheist isn't willing to live as though atheism were true, then he or she is simply an agnostic. Do genuine agnostics haunt internet forums, spewing venom at believers?
Belief or non-belief in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny has no similar ramifications. Absence of belief in the Easter Bunny can pretty much be held in a vacuum. Belief in Zeus, Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny does not have the same evidentiary, theological or philosophical foundation as does (for example) belief in the Christian God, as is evidenced by the fact that billions of sane and intelligent people, including scientists and academics, don't believe in Zeus, Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.
The fact that atheists keep playing this word game, and using fallacious "stamp collecting" and "Easter Bunny" analogies, should be embarrassing to them. If someone insists on calling atheism a "non-belief system" rather than a belief system, I'll accept this as legitimate - but the reality is that any position that warrants the label atheism carries with it ramifications that are closely analogous to a believer's religion.
The definition of atheist is right there in the word.
I don't see it either,; atheists do not do 'believe or not', nor 'everything is answerable by science' (both theistic strawmans(1) but perhaps your rather subtle point is that everything can be subjected to logic and evidence and it can be seen whether it makes the credibility -cut or not.
Bearing in mind that on the wire stuff has to be put in the pending -tray of 'Don't kow - yet' and that logically mandates not believing (The claim) until we know more.
In that respect your point that every question or claim can be logically resolved (believe, or not - yet) is sound. Including whether logic is valid. That gets questioned, too.
(1) not 'strawmen'
Okay. But I think that most atheists believe we can rely on science (in the broad sense), if not now, eventually. Again, YMMV.
the definition and how people behave are two different things.
An atheist is anyone who lacks a belief in God, or gods. Believers would like to categorize and pigeonhole atheists into a single group, the better to despise them. But outside of lacking a belief in God or the gods, atheists are free to subscribe to any belief they choose, and yet still remain atheists. An atheist may be liberal politically, or politically conservative. An atheist may be kind and good, or mean and bad. While it may be true that atheists generally TEND to express more of a politically liberal opinion, there is no rule that requires this.
Atheism is not a club. There are no rules of inclusion, other than having no belief in God or gods.
An atheist is anyone who lacks a belief in God, or gods. Believers would like to categorize and pigeonhole atheists into a single group, the better to despise them. But outside of lacking a belief in God or the gods, atheists are free to subscribe to any belief they choose, and yet still remain atheists. An atheist may be liberal politically, or politically conservative. An atheist may be kind and good, or mean and bad. While it may be true that atheists generally TEND to express more of a politically liberal opinion, there is no rule that requires this.
Atheism is not a club. There are no rules of inclusion, other than having no belief in God or gods.
atheist believe in all sorts of things. From anti-religion activism to cosmic mind and all points in between. And some atheist are irrational jerks just trying to force their way on others.
When a theist says to me "atheism is a religion" I don't even fight'em. I say yeah some are defined false belief just like some theist ... and move on to the died and rose for our sins part.
Bottom line is that people are people. and some groups of people act just like a club and out law law some science that supports anything that they don't think helps their club's activism.
An atheist is anyone who lacks a belief in God, or gods. Believers would like to categorize and pigeonhole atheists into a single group, the better to despise them. But outside of lacking a belief in God or the gods, atheists are free to subscribe to any belief they choose, and yet still remain atheists. An atheist may be liberal politically, or politically conservative. An atheist may be kind and good, or mean and bad. While it may be true that atheists generally TEND to express more of a politically liberal opinion, there is no rule that requires this.
Atheism is not a club. There are no rules of inclusion, other than having no belief in God or gods.
Correct, which means post 42 and 44 contradict each other.
Atheism is simply not believing in gods.
Being a vocal atheist is separate from that, and the atheist dislike of religion being forced on society is also shared by many religious people who understand the separation of church and state is also important for them.
Describing the world is also independent of atheism (and 'activism') , atheism is a conclusion based on what we observe of our reality, and what we do not observe. Many theists do this too, but they compartmentalize their religious beliefs.
I think some people think activism atheism is what atheism is and that activism goal gets to decide the descriptors of the world around us.
I would actually say people that have a ax to grind against religion are less reliable than atheist that just don't care about religion. In terms of discussions on how the universe works and evaluating god claims anyway. Hard core activist, basically militants, have to have their way and their beliefs dominate.
Activist atheism is the more visible kind. As you say. many just want to be left alone. Activist atheism is active only in seeing that the others are left alone to believe what they like - or not.
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