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I completely disagree...I noted Winterville's 48% population growth between 2000 and 2010, just outside of Greenville...that matches the growth in the towns outside of Raleigh...and Leland outside of Wilmington has an even more impressive growth...it was under 2,000 in 2000 and was over 13,000 by 2010...and it was all construction related (not annexation)...that has to go under the heading of "boomtown" in any definition. It also noted huge commercial growth during that period. There is currently developments under construction that will add as many as 10,000 to that population by 2020.
Similarly, the population of some Winston-Salem suburbs (Clemmons and Kernersville) have grown by 35+ percent since 2000. Winston-Salem itself has grown by 25%.
I agree on your interpretation of the original post, it's the subsequent posts attacking various suggestions & posting of high growth rates that were heavily reliant on annexation that changed my mind.
I gotcha. I had to challenge the assertion concerning Fayetteville. When the city "grew" more than the entire metro in the previous decade, you know something's afoot.
I gotcha. I had to challenge the assertion concerning Fayetteville. When the city "grew" more than the entire metro in the previous decade, you know something's afoot.
Fayetteville population in 2000 was 121,015 and in 2010 it was 205,678. Thats a 65% increase...not larger than the entire metro (which is 374,000). In 2005 Fayetteville annexed 27 square miles and gained 46,000 residents.
I do think Fayetteville is going to be a boom town. Now that it DOES have the 205,000 population statistic they're going to use that to try and bring in a lot of big name companies..and I think it will work. Fort Bragg obviously is attached to Fay, and thats going to continue growing for awhile being the 2nd largest army base in the country. 205,000 in 2010 3 years later it sure it crowded, I have NO data to support this but going by how its grown in the past Fayetteville probably has about 230,000 people by now. Not to mention that decade I'm assuming you're referring to is 2000-2010, and after 9/11 and the start of the war, I'm sure a lot of that 65% increase comes from people joining the army, moving their families, etc. Thats what happened from '40-'50.
Fayetteville population in 2000 was 121,015 and in 2010 it was 205,678. Thats a 65% increase...not larger than the entire metro (which is 374,000). In 2005 Fayetteville annexed 27 square miles and gained 46,000 residents.
I do think Fayetteville is going to be a boom town. Now that it DOES have the 205,000 population statistic they're going to use that to try and bring in a lot of big name companies..and I think it will work. Fort Bragg obviously is attached to Fay, and thats going to continue growing for awhile being the 2nd largest army base in the country. 205,000 in 2010 3 years later it sure it crowded, I have NO data to support this but going by how its grown in the past Fayetteville probably has about 230,000 people by now. Not to mention that decade I'm assuming you're referring to is 2000-2010, and after 9/11 and the start of the war, I'm sure a lot of that 65% increase comes from people joining the army, moving their families, etc. Thats what happened from '40-'50.
Fayetteville population in 2000 was 121,015 and in 2010 it was 205,678. Thats a 65% increase...not larger than the entire metro (which is 374,000). In 2005 Fayetteville annexed 27 square miles and gained 46,000 residents.
From 2000-2010, the city of Fayetteville gained 79,549 people. During that same time frame, the metro grew by 29,774.
As I said, the city "grew" more than the entire metro did in the previous decade. That demonstrates a lack of true growth in the city, which came primarily from annexing a large chunk of Fort Bragg.
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I do think Fayetteville is going to be a boom town. Now that it DOES have the 205,000 population statistic they're going to use that to try and bring in a lot of big name companies..and I think it will work.
That has nothing to do with a municipal population figure, and 200K people isn't as big as you're thinking. Big name companies are looking at how educated and skilled the workforce is, the area's infrastructure, cultural offerings, quality of schools, etc. when it comes to relocation. No smart business executive will say, "Ooooh, City X has over 200,000 people, let's set up shop there."
From 2000-2010, the city of Fayetteville gained 79,549 people. During that same time frame, the metro grew by 29,774.
As I said, the city "grew" more than the entire metro did in the previous decade. That demonstrates a lack of true growth in the city, which came primarily from annexing a large chunk of Fort Bragg.
That has nothing to do with a municipal population figure, and 200K people isn't as big as you're thinking. Big name companies are looking at how educated and skilled the workforce is, the area's infrastructure, cultural offerings, quality of schools, etc. when it comes to relocation. No smart business executive will say, "Ooooh, City X has over 200,000 people, let's set up shop there."
"Doug Peters, president of the Fayetteville-Cumberland Chamber of Commerce, said 200,000 is the magic number for some national restaurant and retail chains, such as Kohl's, Macy's and Chili's."
The city of Fayetteville disagrees with you. It does make sense as well. If I was a business exec, I would look at a few more things other than population figures obviously but if I did see an obscure city somewhere with 200k+ people I would definitely express my interest....regardless of whether or not they annexed part of another large town. When you're approaching 200k people its obvious a very populated, urban area. Or 319k for Cumberland County alone. Cumberland County is not THAT big. Obviously Fayetteville is the "central hub" of really the whole Sandhills region. Largest metro in SE NC.
"200k not as big as you're thinking", then what am I thinking? It's bigger than Little Rock, Arkansas, Des Moines, Iowa and hell several several other "large" cities in the US. Also, Fayetteville has won several nationally recognized awards and accolades, also appealing (along with pop figures) to these companies. These accolades include:
#1 "Job Market in the Country" for recent college graduates, The Daily Beast.
#2 "Highest Per Capita Income in North Carolina", surpassing Raleigh and Charlotte, the Bureau of Economic Analysis.
#3 "Most Affordable Housing Market in the Nation, Businessweek Magazine
#3 "Job Market in the Nation", Manpower, Inc.
#5 "Strongest Housing Market in the US", Bloomberg Businessweek.
#7 "America's Strongest Building Markets", Business Week.
#18 "Best Performing City in America", the Milken Institute.
Other honors include:
3-Time Winner of the National Civics League "All-American City" award in 2011
Top 5 Defense Industry Development in US for 2010, Expansion Solutions Magazine.
Last edited by LordHelmit; 04-27-2013 at 11:26 PM..
"Doug Peters, president of the Fayetteville-Cumberland Chamber of Commerce, said 200,000 is the magic number for some national restaurant and retail chains, such as Kohl's, Macy's and Chili's."
The city of Fayetteville disagrees with you. It does make sense as well. If I was a business exec, I would look at a few more things other than population figures obviously but if I did see an obscure city somewhere with 200k+ people I would definitely express my interest....regardless of whether or not they annexed part of another large town. When you're approaching 200k people its obvious a very populated, urban area. Or 319k for Cumberland County alone. Cumberland County is not THAT big. Obviously Fayetteville is the "central hub" of really the whole Sandhills region. Largest metro in SE NC.
When you said "companies," it seemed as though you were talking about major corporations who would employ hundreds or thousands of people, not typical suburban restaurant and retail chains that can be found in any metro of a decent size. That's no biggie.
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"200k not as big as you're thinking", then what am I thinking? It's bigger than Little Rock, Arkansas, Des Moines, Iowa and hell several several other "large" cities in the US.
And those cities have notable employers, retailers, and restaurants that Fayetteville doesn't have and may not be getting for a long time because it's pretty well-known that metro population figures are a much, MUCH better gauge for determining if a city can support these things. If city population was the major determining factor, then Jacksonville, FL would have many, many more amenities than Miami, Atlanta, DC, Boston, etc.
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Also, Fayetteville has won several nationally recognized awards and accolades, also appealing (along with pop figures) to these companies. These accolades include:
#1 "Job Market in the Country" for recent college graduates, The Daily Beast.
#2 "Highest Per Capita Income in North Carolina", surpassing Raleigh and Charlotte, the Bureau of Economic Analysis.
#3 "Most Affordable Housing Market in the Nation, Businessweek Magazine
#3 "Job Market in the Nation", Manpower, Inc.
#5 "Strongest Housing Market in the US", Bloomberg Businessweek.
#7 "America's Strongest Building Markets", Business Week.
#18 "Best Performing City in America", the Milken Institute.
Other honors include:
3-Time Winner of the National Civics League "All-American City" award in 2011
Top 5 Defense Industry Development in US for 2010, Expansion Solutions Magazine.
The major metrics restaurants and retailers are looking at are metropolitan population and income levels, not lists from magazines that change from year to year, many of which have no bearing on whether locating in a particular place is a sound business decision from their perspective.
To reiterate my initial point, a metro the size of Fayetteville that only grew by 30K people over the previous decade is no candidate for boomtown status. As you suggested, the most you can hope for is the entrance of a couple more typical chain restaurants and retailers due to the Fort Bragg annexation.
Eh, Fayetteville might not ever be a massive boomtown like Raleigh, but Ft. Bragg will likely always survive BRAC rounds, which pretty much ensures its continual growth. In fact they benefited heavily from the 2005 round, with FORSCOM and USARC moving there. It doesn't guarantee it'll ever get past its Fayettenam reputation, however.
I don't think that explains it because Raleigh, which is not small compared to other NC cities grew at about 46.3% from 2000-2010. Which is just slightly lower then Clayton and Moorseville. The Triangle and Charlotte are just booming much more then the Triad.
Because it lies both in Alamance and Orange Counties, Mebane is both triad and triangle and grew by 58% from 2000-2010...
I'd say Wilmington because of the potential as a port city. Isn't Wilmington going to become a major port soon with new railroads? Charlotte is going to benefit heavily from Wilmingtons growth. Surely the stretch of 74 will really boom when Charlotte and Wilmington are heavily connected as transit hubs. (Port in Wilmington, Airport/Train network in Charlotte)
I know Wilmington is a port city already, but I thought I remembered hearing something about NC really investing in Wilmington and our new train hub opening up at Charlotte Airport will easily connect to Wilmington.
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