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We have three kids: A 14yr old boy, an 11yr old girl, and a 5yr old girl.
The 14yr old boy wants to stay up all night gaming, swears in most of his sentences, and thinks we are the strictest parents in the world.
On school nights we take his phone from him at 9:30pm. It is often a massive battle. He thinks he should have devices until at least midnight, or preferably all night long.
Often he will sneak another device into his room by creeping into our bedroom and taking one while we sleep, or hoarding older devices that we were not aware of. I often catch him gaming in the middle of the night but if he hears me coming, he quickly switches off the game and then denies everything.
He refuses to go to bed either way and often keeps family members awake with all his noise. When approached, he will say “sure, I’ll keep it down”, but will be noisy again almost immediately. If I start losing my patience, and threatening him with “no devices tomorrow” or something similar, he will yell at the top of his lungs, call me the C word, punch the walls, tell me to "F off", tell me I'm mentally abusing him, tell me he hates me, etc. I will sometimes visit him five times in the night because his noise is preventing me from sleeping, to try to get him to stop making noise and go to bed.
He has zero interest in school or doing chores. His only chore is to do the dishes once every two days, and he says we should be grateful to him for doing this job for us, which we are but he makes out like it’s a huge deal and that he’s very hard done by.
When he doesn’t get his way he routinely threatens suicide or leaving. He feels he needs to get “revenge” for anything that doesn’t go his way and has a deep need to “win” any confrontation.
We don’t know what to do. We think we have all the devices over night but he often gets hold of another one.
What time are other parents seeing their 14yr old go to sleep? Are other 14yr olds doing more chores? Are we too strict? Any advice?
Let me tell you something. If you don't get control of this NOW, you will be sorry. YOu have an addict there and you need to treat him as such.
Of course he has no interest in chores or school. You made that ok. You and your spouse need to stand up to him together or it will be a poison in your family.
I recognized the addiction when my kid was around middle school age. I noticed odd behavior clicking back and forth screens when I tried to help her get an assignment done. She wasn't DOING anything.....just clicking the button between screens.
I will cut to the chase. All devices need to be removed and limited severely. But you need to have a plan BEFORE you do this. I will come back later to explain more. I have to eat dinner.
If it's real....Your son's behavior is not normal. You need to get him professional help.
It's normal for teens now. They are addicted to technology. He doesn't need to put his kid in endless hours of therapy to figure that out. He needs to take back control of his house.
He needs to have the support of his wife and they need to make a plan.
I would encourage you, OP, to NOT take his devices cold turkey. You have a potentially violent situation. You need to put together a plan with your spouse and implement the plan together. Think of kid like a drug addict, and he might be using drugs as well.
I was lucky. My kids were not that bad when I took back control. But I saw it happening to many of the kids in the ADHD parents of teen support group I am in online. The kids get violent. Often the parents disagree on how to handle so the kid takes advantage of the divide. Or one parent is lazy and doesn't want to put in the effort. This is real and it's serious.
It can't be done when you in a weak place emotionally or tired. When I had two kids under 2 who both were going down for naps, I had one kid screaming at one end of the hall and one at the other. I made a plan to let them cry it out. I started with naps so I wasn't tired and spent and emotional after a long day. It took like 2 days and they were sleeping on their own.
With my daughters, they get the phone one hour a day and must turn it in at night. They often sneak it and get it more but they don't hassle me anymore about turning it in. NO WAY do they get it in their rooms at night. They know if they DO hassle me, they get less time with it. The key is to take away things they VALUE and figuring out what that is. I assume you are paying for the phone, too. But use OTHER things to take away besides the devices until the addiction has been broken.
My 18 year old daughter was being disrespectful so here's what I did to get her back in line.
I told her I had two rules regarding her room: No food and clean (picked up) when housecleaners come every two weeks. I thought that was reasonable. But she crossed every boundary I made for her and always has. I let her get away with over the years but it was getting worse, including her attitude. So when she went to school, I went in her room and packed up two boxes of her favorite stuff (her books). She threw a tantrum and I didn't back down. I made an agreement with her dad that he wouldn't yell at her while this was going on. OUr pattern was that she would be a pain in the butt, he would yell at her and I would feel the need to defend her. But I knew the dynamic had to change. So I asked him to let me handle it that night. I had a lot of energy that day (long story, not relevant) so he backed off and I didn't back down. Finally, she said she was moving out and I watched her pack a bag. I knew she had $18 in her checking account and there was no where for her to go. So she literally rolled her back down the driveway and I told her good luck. I just kept calling her bluff. And she cleaned her room. But then she did it again. Another two boxes of books gone. Now, I just need to tell her that if she doesn't keep her room picked up reasonably, more stuff will go. Her dad went and got the boxes and put them in storage. So see, we are working together.
When my kids were toddlers, I made them pull up the blanket on their little toddler beds and make their bed every day. When my daughter was about 7 or 8, she was at day camp one summer and I noticed she didn't make it. So I could have waited until she came home and told her but I got in the car and drove over to camp and took her home and made her make the bed. That gave me a LOT of mileage over the years. When I would threaten her with a punishment, she knew I meant business.
He needs anger management first, then maybe later you can have a rational discussion. Good therapists can be hard to find, so start now.
No, no, no. He doesn't need therapy. Therapists have one interest....lining their pockets and this whole feel good, self esteem nonsense that has ruined our kids lives. They WANT discipline. This stuff has screwed up a few generations of kids.
I remember the first time I played pong, back in the 80s. I could not have predicted the level of addictions that we are seeing today.
Teenagers that we see today are way beyond anything I did. I do know my mother would bust my azz or my dad would give me the death stare. My point is that I did not fear my parents, so I believe the parent must set the tone.
I will say that its disturbing that a child is calling "the person that birthed him" a c___. There might be some anger management, or I believe mental health issues.
I am telling you, it's addiction. This is classic addict behavior.
Thanks. It's real. Not sure how it got to this point, but as a parent I'm disappointed with myself.
I showed him the post and he went berserk. He claims various statements are not true, so I went through it line by line with him. He said he's been better at giving back devices lately (which is true) so doesn't appreciate me saying "It is often a massive battle." But I have a lot of bad memories of the fights. As recently as last night he called me a '*****' for turning off the TV at 10:30pm.
He also wants to point out that I'm always "shouting" at him about these issues. But I feel I start off in a in a good mood using a regular talking tone, and over the course of the night it does turn to shouting. By 2am, I am upset, definitely.
Anyhow, thanks for the replies. I do agree there needs to be some professional intervention here.
Oh, god. STOP THIS!! Stop treating him like your friend or someone you want to like you. Man up and take back your house.
There's a guy who I followed who wrote columns about handling unruly kids. He has therapists who work under his method. She explained to me how he was in psychology in college getting a PHD. His own kid was a terror and failing 3rd grade. School called him and he was mortified. He studied everything he had learned and realized it was all wrong. Too much how the kid feels and being their friend. Ask anyone over 55 if their parents raised them that way. It was all that Dr. Spock garbage. Ask your kid how he FEELS...NOPE. You are not his friend and you are not going to talk him out of this. He's going to manipulate you by convincing you 'he's doing better'. But trust me. And you know this in your heart. He's running the show. You aren't. Let me try to find the name of that guy. He wrote books. You need that kind of help. Not some anger management BS.
She’s very sweet but her biggest weakness is the obsession to her iPhone (like the majority of her generation.), not for gaming, not for social media (she’s not allowed to) but listening to the music and making pictures/videos. Often the only time she and we have the tension or constant back and forth negotiation is for the screen time.-she can’t handle the screen time, she gets very, very happy and excited but then you can tell she starts to get more tense or moody. It’s the sign of overstimulations. Toddlers scream or meltdown when they are over-stimulated, teenagers get snappy and short and moody when they are over-stimulated. Can be from anything, but unfortunately it’s usually the phone these days.
We are, and have been very strict with a few things (she’s otherwise been kind of free-ranged and happy-go-lucky, which in hindsight I regret of giving her too much freedom.) 1: bed time (at 14 she’s in bed usually by 9 am. We specifically told her kids’ growth hormones are the most active during 9-11 pm & 5-7 am. No play and must be in bed unless there are legit reasons-traveling, concerts, health-related matters…etc.) 2: bowel movement 3: safety 4: social media (my husband and I absolutely dislike the current trend of social media for kids, especially TikTok.)-in no order, though safety will always always the very first priority.
Look for a book called https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/res...ley/1120251038-many kids these days are dopamine deficient from the screen time obsession (gaming is definitely one of them.) which results in poor attention, lack of self-regulation, poor emotional regulation and plethora of learning/behavioral issues. Screen time is an addiction, his behavior now is very similar to an addict, his brain doesn’t have the tool to handle the withdrawal (when he’s not playing games.) and like an addict, he wants to play all night for the high.
He needs intervention, whether it’s from school, from you and/or professional therapists.
Set the boundaries, don’t yell at him (because it will not help, only makes him resent you more.) and he needs to ween off the gaming step-by-step. I’m not the expert but understand the screen obsession as my 14 yrs old, if left to her own devices, can probably glue herself to the phone (mostly music and concerts from YouTube. Even that concerned me because once you have fun electronically the mundane “boring” things such as chores and studying can seem to be tedious to even adults.-their brain is still growing and isn’t mature yet. Look at how many adults glue themselves on the phone these days aimlessly scrolling up and down! How can we expect the young kids have the maturity to curb their obsession?!)
The book I mentioned above did have the plan of attack with kids’ screen time obsession. You have to give him incentive and reward. You have to carefully ween off (don’t expect to be cold turkey as it will relapse miserably.) and definitely don’t push too hard, be careful with any verbal and physical violence.
He’s right now probably miserable from the sleep deprivation and being constantly high from the gaming. That’s probably all he can think of and he can’t stop until his dopamine gets fulfilled. He needs good sleep, outdoor time and physical activities. He needs love and understanding (even when he’s at his most difficult self.) and he needs to (metaphor) be in the gaming rehab so if you can work with his school or the professional (talk to his pediatrician who will have resources to guide you.) he will get the support he need, and so will you.
14 is still very young, I understand boys and girls are generally different and every child has their own unique temperament/personality. Most kids, unless a born sociopath, are capable of loving and understanding right from wrong. Investigate his social life and what kinds of kids he hangs out with, if there’s any bad influence from his peers, what his online activities are and set the time frame for his gaming or screen time. Diversify his life so he won’t just be between school and gaming: traveling, outdoor time, social events, physical activities (when they get so tired they will fall asleep no matter how much they fight.) and familiar support. Don’t alienate him, it will not help your mission.
Good luck, check the book, it’s very good and you’ll feel supported because you’re not alone.
Yes! This is why kids can't focus. These devices are HORRIBLE for ADHD kids. ADHD is a dopamine problem and devices give them dopamine hits. That's how I figured it all out.
I told him it’s unacceptable. I said that he won’t get any devices anymore - at all - until they give me a night where the noise is down and we can get a good sleep. To his credit (and his sister) he was far quieter all night and I was not woken once. This is a big step, but I still feel there is a high level of disrespect, with the name-calling.
Parenting style:
One of the problems that has contributed to this situation, is that my wife and I have often been on different pages regarding our parenting styles. I do feel that I should’ve “layed down the law” more decisively over the years, but she is against it and accuses me of being too tough. So I back off and try and find a compromise, but my son is smart and he understands this dynamic. He runs to his mum frequently, usually embellishing stories of what happened. My wife sleeps with ear-plugs, so she has a good sleep every night. Personally I don’t want to sleep with ear plugs in, partly because I want to be alert if there is an intruder or if our 5yr old needs us in the night.
A good example of how it turns out, happened a couple of nights ago. I took devises at 10pm, but the kids stayed up making noise. Prior to going to bed I asked them to please keep it down as there are three of us trying to sleep. I had to get up a couple of times to ask for quiet, and then at 2am, I was up again and by this time I was annoyed. I went into my sons room and shouted at him to stop the noise as I’m tired and haven’t had a good sleep in days. He has a big stand-up fan just beyond his bedroom doorway, and I kicked it in frustration. The next day he told his mother, “Dad came into my room at 2am while I was trying to sleep, he picked up the fan and threw it at me”. This is the kind of thing that happens a lot, he will super-exaggerate things to get his Mum on side, when the truth is he was not “trying to sleep” and I did not “pick up the fan” or throw it. But thankfully lately my wife is getting wise to him and is realising that he’s very crafty with his stories.
I am pretty fed up with all the problems and the cursing. After the success of last night I’m thinking to impose a rule where each time he gives us a bad night he will lose devices, and if he sneaks a device into his room after dark, he will lose them for a week. The idea of switching off wifi at night is also a good one.
Please tell her to read my posts about you being on the same page. I can tell you that, if you don't get on the same page, it will damage or destroy your marriage, too.
My goodness. All of these suggestions of book-educated and wealthy therapists taking over the role of the parent who can't handle a situation with a stupid kid are almost as disturbing as the contents of the OP's post. Good God!
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