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My son and family are on extended stay in Vega Baja, but are looking to buy on Vieques, and build a vacation home and STR. They are going through the federal government for federally owned land in hopes of avoiding legal snafus.
My DILs parents, who are Puerto Rican citizens, had years of legal battles over their lot on Vieques, because the next door neighbor claimed their lot was his..even though they had a deed.
Anyway, they know there can be legal pitfalls, so are proceeding carefully. DIL is an architect, and her father is a contractor, so that will help with affordability.
Again, there's no such thing as "Puerto Rican citizenship", Mari Bras semantics symbolic lawsuit notwithstanding. Certainly no citizenship question that's relevant to the question of deed ownership of land in a PR municipality.
At any rate, found this exchange rather illuminating, albeit cringe af, about the gentrification dynamics.
**TLDR warning***
It is beyond the pale that the framing of this exchange continues to exist in 2022. This is the legacy of that two-timing turncoat Muñoz MarÃn and his chinese paper-menu styled ELA: Birthright born US citizens snapping at each other over who is a "foreigner" 70 years post-facto. Waste of internet bandwidth, which says a lot given how cheap it is in 2022. I guess I'm gonna have to go and peruse the Hawaii sub-forum and see how prevalent and actionable the "haole"-removal sentiment is among the so called bona fide kama'aina. Perhaps theirs is also an example of virtue signaling impotent rage.
Regarding the lawsuit, I abhor that tax evading leech, but discrimination by economic status is not illegal in the Country yet. It's not considered discrimination if you can't afford to pay. My parents are landlords in the island (term rentals, not Air BnB), have been since I was 9. They've seen it all on that front. I didn't see them shedding a tear increasing market rents, and they've rented to fellow natives, and anglos alike, for over 30 years. There was never an ethnic distinction made.
It'll be interesting to see where that lawsuit ends up going. All that said, that pos straight up admits he owes the state of Rhode Island half a million dollars in taxes. That's probably not a good look to get behind for the Act 20/22/60 critters lol.
Where I part company with my fellow island Ricans is this idle entitlement to remain in the place you were born. I hear that argument all the time. As a Realist myself (foreign policy term use, not the colloquial use), my take on that matter is that unless you're willing to pick up a weapon, stand the post Seminole/Sioux/Comanche style and potentially die a young death for it, you are where you can hold ground. I caution myself not to bend too accelerationist in saying that. But at this juncture of my life I've realized that time is money, that justice delayed is justice denied, and thus complaining forever about what you're unwilling to change with force, is about useful as **** on a boar. Possibility of dying over political disputes that don't pertain to my immediate condition is not an academic utterance in my life btw, as an active uniformed servicemember qualified in a flying weapons system, with punishment of imprisonment for refusing to go get shot at. Perhaps that's why I find the gentrification gripe sincere, but lazy. Digressing.
Our Federal Constitution under Article IV Section II, guarantees the free movement of US citizens across the US. None of that denies the thousands of pages of colonialism of the Empire dating to the Monroe Doctrine, the annexation dynamics of the last 5 or so states, of which PR would follow to a T in my opinion. But rehashing that as some sort of call for action in 2022, was, is, and will continue to be, impotent rage. One that is also protected by the 1st Amendment to said Constitution mind you. How you like them apples?
The world is grey. That's not moral relativism, that's realist fact. There's simply no redress available for what my native Ricans are complaining about. There's 2 options: displacement, or blood. The third one is a non-starter: Making state laws restricting freedom of movement to other US citizens is unconstitutional.
I find it somewhat privileged they even get to make that argument, when I had to move myself in order to secure financial freedom (the only bona fide freedom I recognize living in a capitalist system, but that's for another thread) for my progeny. That over making 17K in proverbial Quebradillas, then acting umbraged because some monied Anglo popped the bubble on the idea the world owed me a tropical ocean hill front view in the morning at a discount just because they sliced me out of my mother's womb in a Santurce hospital.
Lastly, in fairness to Ricans, this argument is playing out all over the nation, as individual states deal with the economic displacement of their previously standing populations, and the social friction it creates. At least the connotation of foreigners when I hear about it here in Texas for instance (they mean Californians lol) are made tongue in cheek, and not an actual statutory argument, the way it is implied by the umbraged in the video. Much as it pains me to give the Act 60 locusts a point here, they are not wrong to highlight nobody is a "foreigner" in this rift. Ricans have been ill-served by their local cultural groomers/propagandists for 70 years on that front. Burying your head in the sand and pretending just because you eschew English fluency during your gradeschool years, plug your ears and say "tostones tostones tostones!" repeatedly means your statutory relationship with the United States and your citizenship somehow becomes null and void, is the stuff of fantasy land. A lesson my peers refused to learned for the 18 years I spent born and raised there. Plenty of time to get the memo, but it's here now. Bunch of hypocrites they are, since the majority of those who tar and feathered me in 1998 for merely describing the water, ended up following my "Oregon trail" up to the mainland, 10 years after I did. Theirs being during the 2008 market and housing collapse, which PR never recovered from.
The author of the videos has a clear separatist, pseudo-nationalism promulgating agenda, but the exchanges were well made, so kudos on that piece.
Watched that video above, wow.
I think there's very strong local cultural identity and, no matter what the formal and legal status of the lands is, this warrants protection from displacement for the locals, and I'm sorry for the plight of these people who're being displaced by the rich airbnb-ers. Aribnb is very evil company. I'd never buy in such place, there's enough of this evil happening in the world.
The property owner in that video is absolute evil. I'm not from PR but even I feel outraged watching that. Hopefully, PR will pass laws protecting the locals.
I guess the video did it's purpose, it played with your feelings. How is the owner "evil"? So Puerto Rico wants U.S. benefits and economic protections and open market with the U.S. but you want them to turn into a Banana Republic to make happy a small group for political purposes and show those evil "gringos".
This is your typical island left wing separatist, pseudo-nationalism class warfare. If Americans in the states makes the same comments and faces in public for Puerto Ricans moving in the states they would get crucified and career over but somehow this video is accepted and supported.
Let me explain how this works, if you rent a place, you DON'T own it. You are renting for the price for an amount of time both parties agreed. If the owner sells (because he is losing revenue) and the new owner wants to make his property into a mall or hotel or a spa/gym or upgrade the condo and charge market value that is their right and their business.
It's really greedy that people that have no idea about cost of running a private condo think they deserve a $600 a month rent for life because they are special and deserving.
I had an uncle in the early '80s that owned a condo in Bayamon (brand new at the time) called Bayamonte that later he was hired to manage it. He showed me the maintenance that condo requires everyday from a full time crew, it was 4 people plus my uncle. Then a security guard from 6 pm til 6 am. The elevators needed maintenance because they were always breaking down and that condo had a basketball court but no pool. He was paying $600 a month for a 2 bedroom and 1 bathroom (it was 3 bedroom but he broke a wall and made the living room larger) and this was 1981 to 1985 era. He lived on the 19th floor.
My uncle had to quit and left because part of his job was that if the tenants didn't pay rent he could turn the power off. He had to shut it off until he received payment and make constant notices at the door and one time his car parked in the condo was thrown acid on the paint by one of the tenants that was behind in payments and it got personal so he quit and moved to a house. He said the pay wasn't worth it. It was drama dealing with a small minority everyday. Plus he had to give fines for tenants breaking the condo rules of throwing garbage from the balcony and leaving trash bags in the hallway and parking at the wrong spots. He got tired and left. People start hating you for enforcing the rules.
I'm just telling you some people think they are entitled and feel it's a right to be there and never bother to read the contract or their responsibilities. $600 a month in a private condo in 2022 with a tennis court and pool and a modern condo the owner is losing money.
When people move to a condo they don't want to deal with the painting, mowing the lawn, cleaning the pool, or making sure the elevators work or anything on the outside of the condo. Well folks, that is not free, somebody has to pay for it. Add that if you rent a condo, anything that breaks inside the condo has to be fix by the owner. The owner of the condo has to pay the HOA fee, property taxes and maintenance inside of the condo living by the renter.
I know some in Puerto Rico that got tired of the work of keeping a house and they moved to a private condo that they don't have to worry about anything but guess what? is not free, you have to pay for it. These people in the video don't.
Last edited by SanJuanStar; 09-12-2022 at 12:48 PM..
Again, I don't get people that goes in a place and fixes it and invest money are evil. Have you seen some of these properties abandoned and neglected?
We already have government managing housing and section 8. It's call "caserios" and low level housing which is public housing. We don't need more of that and We don't need more taxes to kill investments. We want people that will invest and make living conditions better not scare them away.
The reason the P.R. government offers low taxes is for them to come and invest their money and take the risk. You think if you raise my taxes I will take the risk on top of that? There has to be an incentive to take the risk.
There is NO way that a condo owner is making any profit by charging $600 per unit with all the maintenance demand a private condo takes unless the government is subsidizing the cost which means taxpayers are paying for it. I'm talking about the people in the video. If you can't afford a private condo that does everything for you then maybe you need a cheaper place that you do the maintenance.
Reminds me a little of food stamps. They give you social aid to buy the uncooked food to cook it yourself and not hot food ready made or fast food or alcohol or non-food.. They do this so the people learn how to be self efficient and cook their own food.
When you rent or buy a condo you have to read the contract and know that free maintenance is not free. The video is disingenuous trying to compare a private free maintenance condo to a house in the area in prices. Apples and oranges.
so air bnb has enabled an expansion of tourism and that's evil? talk about over the top rhetoric. one of the largest issues in puerto rico is the government's inability to process title and getting legal improvements approved, so things happen illegally, but when you don't have title, guess what happens when you go to apply for FEMA assistance?
I think the entire system, in all of the US, not just what's only starting to come to PR, is screwed and is directed against at least half of the population that isn't as "shrewd" as others. That's why there's housing crisis.
did you say in all of the US? oh yes you did. so before the us besoculaters pipe up. this is happening everywhere
You ruin the debate by putting a video of Bad Bunny and using the same woman with her left wing separatist pseudo-nationalism class warfare that is very ignorant how free markets and capitalism works.
You notice she never speaks with economic experts that knows the real numbers and how the market works. She only speaks with low information voters and people with an extreme political opinion and she injects her opinions and wishful thinking and uses the camera to sway public opinion to a very narrow narrative.
A Navy Seal once said that people like to talk in a very educated manner of things they know nothing about.
This is what our taxpayers money goes to in P.R. to educate people that talk educated of things they know nothing about and distort facts with a camera. She interviews a Dominican woman that has been in Puerto Rico for 25 years that is renting for low rent and she has NO skills other that she is a housewife and she keeps lots of garbage in her small apartment for 1 person and expects the people to pay for the moving and pay for a place of her liking and that the new owner sent her a notice that she has to move after the lease is up.
The interviewer never bothers to ask the Dominican woman if she entered Puerto Rico illegally and what's her status today. She doesn't bother to ask the woman if she every reads the renting contract she signed for 25 years that she has to renew every year? Then the interviewer injects her bias opinion accusing legally rightful owners of taking what belongs to people in the video like it was a crime. Really? taking what belongs to them? the ignorance of the law and how capitalism works.
Then she goes to Puerta de Tierra that is fill with crimes and drugs and talks to low information voters why they are broke with no skills or future and their answer is because they are poor and black (they are not, they are tan and white) and the way to live in Puerta de Tierra is by more government housing buildings under the full dependence of the government and she lets him get away with that lie because it pushes her narrative of class warfare and that American capitalism is evil. The guy is uneducated and ignorant but what's her excuse because she is not. She ignores the fact that American investors are investing in tourism in that area to bring good paying jobs for P.R., unless she thinks those hotels, condos and stores runs by itself
Then she brings bad history about Puerto Rico and says that the U.S. exploits P.R. by ignoring economy and history that isn't the case. If you look at the poverty of P.R. in 1898 and compare it to 2022 under the U.S., the economy grew and many people got out of poverty. If you can go to a Bad Bunny concert with smart phones and buy lots of material things and have your education paid and a bunch of social services then you are not poor even if you say it 100 times.
This is garbage. She calls herself a "journalist" and hides by that diploma the taxpayers paid for her at a college in Puerto Rico but she is actually a left wing anti-capitalist anti-American activist who is a flame thrower and uses her education and low information voters and a very 1 sided view to push her narrative.
When you have people that say that everything belongs to them including the work and investments of others then they are socialists and some communists and are dangerous and want to make everybody miserable as them. I never seen a bunch of dumb people with NO idea about the law, capitalism and how free markets works or how to grow the econom to create jobs and a better Puerto Rico. They play the victim card all the day, pretend that everything belongs to them including your work and earnings and play the class warfare all day.
These are the same people that goes to resorts in Puerto Rico and demand that they leave that the property belongs to them and their investments and earnings belongs to them.
The woman in the video is bad. Flame thrower.
Last edited by SanJuanStar; 09-17-2022 at 03:34 PM..
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