Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
For all the complaining I see about taxes there, what makes people stay in spite of it? I know many are born there and are just accustomed to it. But others move there and are fine, and they aren't necessarily all rich either. Others I've seen post on here that they moved to lower taxed states and ended up moving back. So it seems that either there's things provided by the taxes that are lacking elsewhere, or that the struggle to make there financially is worth it for other reasons.
Listen, we are Americans and we can complain about whatever we want. (see the pension thread). The taxes in VT are a valid complaint!!
Where do you live? What are YOUR taxes like?
Anyhoo...I'll take a stab at this.
We left Los Angeles to move here 20 yrs ago. We travelled through Maine, NH, and then VT and were very attracted to the rolling green landscape.
The air was fresh and clean and still is for the most part. The lakes, ponds, rivers and streams are clean, although there are places with algae problems and that cyanobacteria.
There was very little crime back then (things are changing in that regard, but that's another thread). Most of the crime is drug related.
There is virtually no traffic.
People are generally nice once you get to know them and it's the kind of place where people will let you go first at the intersection, have the parking spot they were going to pull into, or even pull over on the side of the road if you are stopped and ask you if you need any help. (don't let a somewhat gruff exterior dissuade you).
The seasons are beautiful, sometimes fierce, but hey, this is Earth. There is a lot to be said for living with the rhythms of nature. A lot.
We are generally not subject to the unrest and violence of the big city. "Protests" are usually 10-15 old hippies holding signs or candles.
It is quiet. You can hear leaves falling off the trees.
I think my husband put it very well when he said "It is worth the price of admission." because taxes and costs are high, but the tradeoffs to move to somewhere less expensive don't seem worth it.
Listen, we are Americans and we can complain about whatever we want. (see the pension thread). The taxes in VT are a valid complaint!!
Where do you live? What are YOUR taxes like?
Anyhoo...I'll take a stab at this.
We left Los Angeles to move here 20 yrs ago. We travelled through Maine, NH, and then VT and were very attracted to the rolling green landscape.
The air was fresh and clean and still is for the most part. The lakes, ponds, rivers and streams are clean, although there are places with algae problems and that cyanobacteria.
There was very little crime back then (things are changing in that regard, but that's another thread). Most of the crime is drug related.
There is virtually no traffic.
People are generally nice once you get to know them and it's the kind of place where people will let you go first at the intersection, have the parking spot they were going to pull into, or even pull over on the side of the road if you are stopped and ask you if you need any help. (don't let a somewhat gruff exterior dissuade you).
The seasons are beautiful, sometimes fierce, but hey, this is Earth. There is a lot to be said for living with the rhythms of nature. A lot.
We are generally not subject to the unrest and violence of the big city. "Protests" are usually 10-15 old hippies holding signs or candles.
It is quiet. You can hear leaves falling off the trees.
I think my husband put it very well when he said "It is worth the price of admission." because taxes and costs are high, but the tradeoffs to move to somewhere less expensive don't seem worth it.
That's how I feel about staying in the New York suburbs, I don't want to pay lower taxes someplace else and get more crime, less hospitals and doctors, less stores and restaurants close to home, etc.
Listen, we are Americans and we can complain about whatever we want. (see the pension thread). The taxes in VT are a valid complaint!!
Where do you live? What are YOUR taxes like?
Anyhoo...I'll take a stab at this.
We left Los Angeles to move here 20 yrs ago. We travelled through Maine, NH, and then VT and were very attracted to the rolling green landscape.
The air was fresh and clean and still is for the most part. The lakes, ponds, rivers and streams are clean, although there are places with algae problems and that cyanobacteria.
There was very little crime back then (things are changing in that regard, but that's another thread). Most of the crime is drug related.
There is virtually no traffic.
People are generally nice once you get to know them and it's the kind of place where people will let you go first at the intersection, have the parking spot they were going to pull into, or even pull over on the side of the road if you are stopped and ask you if you need any help. (don't let a somewhat gruff exterior dissuade you).
The seasons are beautiful, sometimes fierce, but hey, this is Earth. There is a lot to be said for living with the rhythms of nature. A lot.
We are generally not subject to the unrest and violence of the big city. "Protests" are usually 10-15 old hippies holding signs or candles.
It is quiet. You can hear leaves falling off the trees.
I think my husband put it very well when he said "It is worth the price of admission." because taxes and costs are high, but the tradeoffs to move to somewhere less expensive don't seem worth it.
I think it depends on where you live in Vermont. I have come to the realization that living in a small rural, frankly, uncivilized town is not for me. I thought they would have good morals and values but after twenty years, very few do or maybe they don't have the same values I was taught. I think I would have fit in better if I moved to an area with a majority of transplants or bought a house on a dead end road. With the taxes I pay, I should have laws being enforced (not the police's fault) and children getting a good education. Where I live, this does not exist. So people considering moving to Vermont should rent for a few years to make sure they are happy before setting down roots. That is just what I have experienced.
Vermont was safe and had a decent amount of freedom when it came to things like owning guns and hunting and so forth, along with a lot of public lands and trails. Now none of that is really true (well the public lands are still there but more crowded and with a lot more vandalism than I used to see). The state has rather dramatically gone downhill the past few years. Rich(er) transplants have been buying up property and making everything unaffordable for locals and many towns, mine included, are trying to rush in town wide appraisals to ream everyone on taxes based on the bubble prices.
I actually agree with many of the points that are made in the previous two posts.
There will come a point where many of us will decide that what VT has to offer is NOT worth the price of admission. The problem will be finding a new place.
The state has indeed gone downhill over the last few years but we've been somewhat sheltered from it by living away from the city and on a road with few houses. The problem IMO is the liberal/progressive state legislature and the lack of adequate policing coupled with liberal judiciary. Anything even remotely 'conservative' has no chance of passing and it is rare that a conservative wins an office.
I actually agree with many of the points that are made in the previous two posts.
There will come a point where many of us will decide that what VT has to offer is NOT worth the price of admission. The problem will be finding a new place.
The state has indeed gone downhill over the last few years but we've been somewhat sheltered from it by living away from the city and on a road with few houses. The problem IMO is the liberal/progressive state legislature and the lack of adequate policing coupled with liberal judiciary. Anything even remotely 'conservative' has no chance of passing and it is rare that a conservative wins an office.
Republicans win in my district. I have been a Republican my entire adult life. In fact, I was watching Fox News this morning and saw the person that interviewed me for my start in politics, Ed Romaine, who just won the Suffolk Country Executive seat on Long Island. Those are the Republicans I respect and would vote for. This will be the first year that I will not vote for a Republican in Vermont and it is going to kill me because I think the Progressives are destroying this country. But I have strong beliefs about certain things and could not live with myself if I voted for a party that supports it.
Vermont was safe and had a decent amount of freedom when it came to things like owning guns and hunting and so forth, along with a lot of public lands and trails. Now none of that is really true (well the public lands are still there but more crowded and with a lot more vandalism than I used to see). The state has rather dramatically gone downhill the past few years. Rich(er) transplants have been buying up property and making everything unaffordable for locals and many towns, mine included, are trying to rush in town wide appraisals to ream everyone on taxes based on the bubble prices.
Didn't they vote in Montpelier to have the state reappraise in the future for "equity". They said that black communities were being appraised much higher than white communities. What a load of BS that is. They are basically accusing local town listers of being racists.
The state has gone downhill and very unaffordable. We are getting hit left and right with higher prices but salaries are staying low. It is only getting harder.
As for the richer transplants....when I lived on Long Island our transplants were people from Queens, Manhattan and illegals. When I went back to visit my daughter, the once beautiful area I moved from looks like Queens and it is full of illegals. It was heartbreaking to see and I see it starting up in Addison County. Our government is to blame for this, including our governor. He was labeled one of the 18 most corrupt governors in the nation a few years ago, begging the President to send double the amount of refugees that Vermont was supposed to let in.
I don't know why you feel our freedom has been taken away from us as far as guns and hunting. No laws changed as far as gun ownership but as far as hunting, I feel they are too lax. I don't feel my rights are being taken into consideration when I have to listen to my neighbor to the west of me with his arsenal of firearms target practicing all day every day from the first nice day of Spring until the snow falls. And then the neighbor to the east of me is playing coyote howling recordings to lure them in and we have to listen to his dogs attacking the wildlife. Now more than ever, I feel people should be able to hunt for food, but the Redneck behavior I have witnessed this year has already caused us to lose one good neighbor and I'm sure we are going to lose more. This area has changed a lot. I love my home but sometimes I would rather stay at work than come home to the noise. You may think I'm exaggerating but I'm not. It used to be really peaceful here but it is the locals bringing the area down. People just don't care how their actions affect others.
Republicans win in my district. I have been a Republican my entire adult life. In fact, I was watching Fox News this morning and saw the person that interviewed me for my start in politics, Ed Romaine, who just won the Suffolk Country Executive seat on Long Island. Those are the Republicans I respect and would vote for. This will be the first year that I will not vote for a Republican in Vermont and it is going to kill me because I think the Progressives are destroying this country. But I have strong beliefs about certain things and could not live with myself if I voted for a party that supports it.
I am not much of a fan of Gov Scott because he has not delivered on his promise to 'make VT more affordable.' Of course, how can he do that with a liberal/progressive legislature who only know how to tax the already overtaxed, who can't come up with any other way to fund education other than off the backs of regular working class home owners, who can see no way to attract businesses here to broaden the tax base, who give everything to the homeless, to the drug addicts, to the mentally ill, the criminals and leave the rest of us (literally) out in the cold.
We are retired, but our retirement income is worth less and less here. We did some work on our house in October, and with the recent re-appraisals, if we have to sell and move (where???) at least we will recoup those expenses.
*
We have some republican wins in our local races here, but those are fewer and further btwn. They also gerry-mandered the voting districts to put more conservative areas in with the lib/prog districts.
Didn't they vote in Montpelier to have the state reappraise in the future for "equity". They said that black communities were being appraised much higher than white communities. What a load of BS that is. They are basically accusing local town listers of being racists.
The state has gone downhill and very unaffordable. We are getting hit left and right with higher prices but salaries are staying low. It is only getting harder.
As for the richer transplants....when I lived on Long Island our transplants were people from Queens, Manhattan and illegals. When I went back to visit my daughter, the once beautiful area I moved from looks like Queens and it is full of illegals. It was heartbreaking to see and I see it starting up in Addison County. Our government is to blame for this, including our governor. He was labeled one of the 18 most corrupt governors in the nation a few years ago, begging the President to send double the amount of refugees that Vermont was supposed to let in.
I don't know why you feel our freedom has been taken away from us as far as guns and hunting. No laws changed as far as gun ownership but as far as hunting, I feel they are too lax. I don't feel my rights are being taken into consideration when I have to listen to my neighbor to the west of me with his arsenal of firearms target practicing all day every day from the first nice day of Spring until the snow falls. And then the neighbor to the east of me is playing coyote howling recordings to lure them in and we have to listen to his dogs attacking the wildlife. Now more than ever, I feel people should be able to hunt for food, but the Redneck behavior I have witnessed this year has already caused us to lose one good neighbor and I'm sure we are going to lose more. This area has changed a lot. I love my home but sometimes I would rather stay at work than come home to the noise. You may think I'm exaggerating but I'm not. It used to be really peaceful here but it is the locals bringing the area down. People just don't care how their actions affect others.
Lots of laws have changed on guns. They just passed a 72 hour waiting period after passing a background check to pick up a gun. When it's a 2 hour round trip to a gun store that's a big deal. The magazine ban a few years back. And now Dick Sears (senate judiciary chair) is saying he'd support a semi-auto ban. All of which most gunowners in the state are ignoring or finding ways around. But the state won't keep career felons locked up, won't allow towns to clean up the hotels full of homeless that are the source of a lot of crime, etc., but sure as heck will go after you if you defend yourself. There was a judge last year basically coerced into retiring because the legislature was clearly going to block him from staying at his review because he has been hard on the criminals, while Judge Jiron and similar continue to destroy communities with their decisions (the Caledonian Record kept close track of Jiron but he's simply moved to another district to do the same).
What you're describing is people just being inconsiderate of neighbors. And that's gotten terrible. There's just some plain nasty stuff I'm seeing that's wearing me thin. Things are rapidly changing but not in good ways. I target practice by my home. Just as with construction projects and running chainsaws and such I won't be out before 8 AM or after 5 PM but there is someone a couple miles away who will be out whenever. I'm a bit insulated from that but not always depending on wind direction. The ATV crowd is my biggest source of trouble. I used to be fairly supportive of them but no longer. Laws won't help you anymore than me. When I've reported things to the police they basically don't even care. Always too busy to send someone. Told me once to email photos and videos to a state trooper. He never responded once.
The kids can't read or do basic math coming out of the local schools but we continue to dump money into them like that will fix them, paid with taxes that are driving people out of their homes and/or further and further into poverty. Everything is simply a mess and/or failing in this state but people keep plowing ahead doing the same things that got us here.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
(see the pension thread). The taxes in VT are a valid complaint!! 
