The First Car-free Community in the US (metro, subway, Boston)

[IC_deLight]

Originally Posted by chirack

...If you are paying $3,000 a month for rent, you are spending enough to buy a house in most places in the United States for less and most houses in the United States are 3 bed room houses. If you have a family, having 2-3 bedrooms trumps the 1 bed room place in Culdesac that goes for $1,300.

You are absolutely correct.

Just wanted to point out the "from the $1,300s" was the advertised base for a zero bedroom studio. A 1 bedroom is going to cost you more.

[nirvana07]

The floor plan of this community talks of a "Light Rail Station".
Is this station already there? If not, who is going to build it, and where will it connect to, and how much time will that take?

[Stadtmensch]

Originally Posted by chirack

A 20-30 year old house has still got lots of life left. I grew up in a house that was much older than that. Age of house has little to do with property values. There are million dollar houses made of wood, in San Francisco that are 100 years old. A old house can sell well and you can sell anytime you like provided the bank goes along with it and you either have cash or sell for more the what is still owed. You can do anything you want to a 20 year old house on the interior. New appliances, no problem. Additions or renovations not much problem at all.

If you are paying $3,000 a month for rent, you are spending enough to buy a house in most places in the United States for less and most houses in the United States are 3 bed room houses. If you have a family, having 2-3 bedrooms trumps the 1 bed room place in Culdesac that goes for $1,300.

Also, having a car is handy when taking children to daycare because you likely are going somewhere else afterwards(like work) and you need to be able to pick the child up before they charge extra for not picking up the child on time. Public transit and bikes are often slower esp. when traveling the distance to work(which might not even be in your city).

There are million dollar houses in SF, because SF has become a popular place to live in, but it can also go the other way if you live in a place that was in decline like Detroit where you can buy a house for a dollar now.

And some house types increase in value and others decrease in value. If it is old it is more likely to sell for higher price if it is looking good and has some historical value. Not all house types are like that.

So in other words you need to buy the right house in the right place to have any significant price increase. Compared to what most people make with stocks this is nothing. Hell you could have made more with Bitcoin.

You can also rent a 3 bedroom apartment for far less than $3,000 in Tempe AZ. It all depends on the place, the amenities, the age and so on. On average renting is cheaper than buying and you may not have built up real estate asset, but you may have used the money for stocks or other financial investments that have much higher returns and the best thing as a renter is you don't lose your home if you just want to realize your gains. You can sell your stocks without having to leave your place.

You can take your children to daycare by bicycle and then just ride to work with your bicycle. Some people here do this every day. All you need is some basic density and the infrastructure to support your mode of travel.

Originally Posted by IC_deLight

Nope it's worth considerably more.
Your logic has many holes.
Your argument here is about as nonsensical as your map of "land values" for the United States.
Taking an average across a large area and then comparing it to other averages is useless.

Housing and real estate are very local.


Well if that were true it's just our problem and none of your concern.


Again this is rather useless. You are using an aggregate of the stock market and dividing by an average house price.
The stock you actually purchase and sell and the house you actually purchase and sell are the only things pertinent to the individual. Housing prices and the change in housing prices varies greatly across the United States.



Your numbers are flaky at best. Again the stock you actually purchase and sell and the house you actually purchase and sell are the only things pertinent to the individual. Oh and you might invest in something that you might be able to realize a gain from at some point in the future. But you can't live in it and you don't have the benefit of hindsight as to whether or when it might be profitable.

Also as noted above in Germany you will have to pay 45% income tax IF you realize any gains plus you still have the cost of housing. Here you can gain from the sale of the house and exclude up to $250K/$500K (single/married) of gain from taxation plus deduct mortgage interest.


Guess you have a different definition of "similar" and of "winning". You can't deduct mortgage interest for owner-occupied housing, only investment/rental property. You have a cap on capital gains deductions of 1000 EUR and don't otherwise get to exclude gains from the sale of the house at all. Yup that's not even close to similar.

Your country's policies promote renting, not owning. As a result you rent.

If it was so great there you would not have such narcissistic envy for the United States.

You aren't even in any competition. I prefer living in the United States and that's where I am. I win.

Your financial situation is not only local, it is even individual, so is my, and I am not going to show you my numbers. Since we are talking about the US and Germany I am using averages, because countries are averages of the people, economies and cultures. And you claimed general things about Germany, so I am using statistics to refute your claims. That's how it works.

But I know you will continue to use your ridiculous talking points about how averages don't matter and how the term "city" is strictly legal. Go on and embarrass yourself!

Yeah I can't live in my stocks, what a great finding, but I can live in my apartment and realize my profits without having to leave my place. Isn't that great? I can even flip my strategy from one second to another and put my money into a new stock with more potential. And I can switch my apartment and move to another place much quicker. I am flexible in any way, you are not. You are stuck with your original investment decision and your mortgage.

Again you don't know how the tax system works in Germany.

In Germany the income tax is irrelevant for capital gains. We have a capital gains tax (Kapitalertragssteuer) for stocks and other financial assets, which is just 25% for capital gains above 1,000 EUR.

BTW, the highest income tax in Germany is 42%. The average income tax rate in Germany (20%) is lower than in the United States (25%).

In Germany home sales are tax free if you do not rent out and do not resell within 10 years after buying.

Our government subsidizes buying a home with attractive mortgage rates (Förderkredit) by the KfW bank.

The average mortgage rates in Germany (1-4%) are way lower than in the United States (5-7%).

Yet the share of homes owned without mortgage is higher in Germany.

The lowest income quintile spends 40% of their income on mortgages in the United States compared to just 30% in Germany.

But more importantly, our tenant protection laws are very strong, making renting vs buying the much better option.

Just like in Switzerland, which has the highest share of renters in the world.

On top of that college for your kids is included in taxes and daycare is much cheaper than in the US.

Our healthcare costs are just a fraction of yours.

You are making a bad deal over there, ironically due to your blind hate of "socialism".

[NORTY FLATZ]

There is a large percentage of seniors, whom can't/don't drive anymore. If you know of one/some, OFFER to take them to the store or bank/doc's appointment. You may just save a life.

[rabbit33]

The elderly person who can't drive, is probably also not up for walking half a mile to the store in the sun in Tempe in August.

Remarkably enough the climate conditions in the Mojave Desert are just a wee bit more severe than in Germany.

[Stadtmensch]

Originally Posted by rabbit33

The elderly person who can't drive, is probably also not up for walking half a mile to the store in the sun in Tempe in August.

Remarkably enough the climate conditions in the Mojave Desert are just a wee bit more severe than in Germany.

Dense development actually has two advantages here. I walk 2 minutes to the nearest grocery store. That's probably not much more than it takes for most Americans to walk from the parking lot to the grocery store. And secondly, dense buildings provide shade. If you then plant a few trees, it is definitely much cooler.

[chirack]

Originally Posted by Stadtmensch

Dense development actually has two advantages here. I walk 2 minutes to the nearest grocery store. That's probably not much more than it takes for most Americans to walk from the parking lot to the grocery store. And secondly, dense buildings provide shade. If you then plant a few trees, it is definitely much cooler.

Trees don't grow in desserts like AZ and dense building don't provide shade.

[Stadtmensch]

Originally Posted by chirack

Trees don't grow in desserts like AZ and dense building don't provide shade.

Of course they do => https://goo.gl/maps/sKXdFkgmovNk2WPj8

[IC_deLight]

Originally Posted by Stadtmensch

There are million dollar houses in SF, because SF has become a popular place to live in, but it can also go the other way if you live in a place that was in decline like Detroit where you can buy a house for a dollar now.

And some house types increase in value and others decrease in value. If it is old it is more likely to sell for higher price if it is looking good and has some historical value. Not all house types are like that.

So in other words you need to buy the right house in the right place to have any significant price increase. Compared to what most people make with stocks this is nothing. Hell you could have made more with Bitcoin.

You can also rent a 3 bedroom apartment for far less than $3,000 in Tempe AZ. It all depends on the place, the amenities, the age and so on. On average renting is cheaper than buying and you may not have built up real estate asset, but you may have used the money for stocks or other financial investments that have much higher returns and the best thing as a renter is you don't lose your home if you just want to realize your gains. You can sell your stocks without having to leave your place.

You can take your children to daycare by bicycle and then just ride to work with your bicycle. Some people here do this every day. All you need is some basic density and the infrastructure to support your mode of travel.



Your financial situation is not only local, it is even individual, so is my, and I am not going to show you my numbers. Since we are talking about the US and Germany I am using averages, because countries are averages of the people, economies and cultures. And you claimed general things about Germany, so I am using statistics to refute your claims. That's how it works.

But I know you will continue to use your ridiculous talking points about how averages don't matter and how the term "city" is strictly legal. Go on and embarrass yourself!

Yeah I can't live in my stocks, what a great finding, but I can live in my apartment and realize my profits without having to leave my place. Isn't that great? I can even flip my strategy from one second to another and put my money into a new stock with more potential. And I can switch my apartment and move to another place much quicker. I am flexible in any way, you are not. You are stuck with your original investment decision and your mortgage.

Again you don't know how the tax system works in Germany.

In Germany the income tax is irrelevant for capital gains. We have a capital gains tax (Kapitalertragssteuer) for stocks and other financial assets, which is just 25% for capital gains above 1,000 EUR.

BTW, the highest income tax in Germany is 42%. The average income tax rate in Germany (20%) is lower than in the United States (25%).

In Germany home sales are tax free if you do not rent out and do not resell within 10 years after buying.

Our government subsidizes buying a home with attractive mortgage rates (Förderkredit) by the KfW bank.

The average mortgage rates in Germany (1-4%) are way lower than in the United States (5-7%).

Yet the share of homes owned without mortgage is higher in Germany.

The lowest income quintile spends 40% of their income on mortgages in the United States compared to just 30% in Germany.

But more importantly, our tenant protection laws are very strong, making renting vs buying the much better option.

Just like in Switzerland, which has the highest share of renters in the world.

On top of that college for your kids is included in taxes and daycare is much cheaper than in the US.

Our healthcare costs are just a fraction of yours.

You are making a bad deal over there, ironically due to your blind hate of "socialism".

Except you have to live with being in Germany and all that entails.

You have routinely tried to come up with inapplicable numbers and calculations. In one of your prior aliases you erroneously aggregated lot and house when trying to compare on a price per square foot basis. You tried tunnel length per capita as if that made any sense anywhere. You fool yourself into believing you are more intelligent than Americans or anyone else in virtually every post. In reality you are a nation of renters because of government policy - not because of intelligence on your part. Many of your posts exude sheer ignorance because your experience is curating numbers from articles that meet your religious preferences for density.

Most recently you made sweeping ridiculous statements including the title of this thread itself. You bizarrely tried to claim this was family friendly without actually thinking about the resources or things a family needs. You didn’t consider where a school was or how they would get there. How the workers who would not be able to afford these resort style rents would be able to get to work given that the woke crowd is promoting no cars and deliberately excluding any significant parking for workers or even customers. Your “bike everywhere” mantra shows a complete lack of common sense. You don’t need a bike on the 17 acre island. As soon as you leave the island you will be immersed in the infrastructure you foolishly thought you were getting away from. If you haven’t figured it out by now 115 degrees F is not conducive to bicycling or walking anywhere.

You also posted rants against air conditioning under prior aliases. You would be a lonely anti-air conditioning zealot in Tempe. Your mantra would be even less effective there.

Also of course there is less expensive housing to rent in Tempe. You could OWN housing for what these cost. Density doesn’t cost less - it cost more and you get less! You continue to undermine your beliefs with the examples you think are so great. All your nonsense above about having more to invest as a renter certainly would not lead to renting here but rather renting or owning in the less dense housing- preferably with a lot, a garage for your car, and a driveway.

[Stadtmensch]

Originally Posted by IC_deLight

Except you have to live with being in Germany and all that entails.
You have routinely tried to come up with inapplicable numbers and calculations. In one of your prior aliases you erroneously aggregated lot and house when trying to compare on a price per square foot basis - erroneously. You tried tunnel length per capita as if that made any sense anywhere. You fool yourself into believing you are more intelligent than Americans or anyone else in virtually every post. In reality you are a nation of renters because of government policy - not because of intelligence on your part. Many of your posts exude sheer ignorance because your experience is curating numbers from articles that meet your religious preferences for density.

Most recently you made sweeping ridiculous statements including the title of this thread itself. You bizarrely tried to claim this was family friendly without actually thinking about the resources or things a family needs. You didn’t consider where a school was or how they would get there. How the workers who would not be able to afford these resort style rents would be able to get to work given that the woke crowd is promoting no cars and deliberately exclude any significant parking for workers or even customers. Your “bike everywhere” mantra shows a complete lack of common sense. You don’t need a bike on the 17 acre island. As soon as you leave the island you will be immersed in the infrastructure you foolishly thought you were getting away from. If you haven’t figured it out by now 115 degrees F is not conducive to bicycling or walking anywhere.

Also of course there is less expensive housing to rent in Tempe. You could own housing for what these cost. Density doesn’t cost less - it cost more and you get less! You continue to undermine your beliefs with the examples you think are so great. All your nonsense above about having more to invest as a renter certainly would not lead to renting here but rather renting or owning in the less dense housing- preferably with a lot, a garage for your car, and a driveway.

You have serious issues.