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I am a senior citizen (late 60's) who very much enjoys having a car and using it. I do not enjoy public transportation and haven't used it in decades.
I live in the Northeast and would have no interest in waiting for buses and trains in either the steaming heat of summer or the freezing cold of winter. Nor would I want to try to Uber/Lyft to my medical appointments, especially since I often combine those with other errands such as grocery shopping (which involve multiple shopping bags).
And in previous years, my car expeditions, especially in the evenings, often included my dog(s).
I could not go to many of my favorite places in my home state without a car, unless I spent a lot of money on Uber or Lyft.
I will happily continue to drive for as long as I can. I have a fairly small car (a Toyota Camry), not a big van (wouldn't want one), good for semi-urban and urban parking. It's lasted a long time. And I am fortunate enough to have access to an indoor garage.
I also enjoy taking frequent walks during every season but winter (and some days of winter that aren't too cold or icy).
Anyone who's all postiive on this concept ever been to Phoenix/Tempe in July?
I have.
Hoo boy. Shade, sun, doesn't matter. Your 80 year old grandmother who's too frail and weak to drive, WILL DIE in a very few minutes in that heat outside. Don't forget, too, that old folks lose much of their ability to sweat and self-cool that way.
Mr. State Central Planning Commissar REALLY REALLY ought to come visit some of the places in the US he's only looked at Street View, and actually LEARN SOMETHING.
Isn't it funny that Phoenix/Tempe has a very large population of 80-year-old grandmothers who seem to do just fine.
... The buildings are spaced very close together, perhaps in an effort to maximize the number of units on the piece of land, for maximum revenue....
There, fixed that for you.
Yes, strip out all resident parking, fill that space with more apartment buildings, and promote it as an amenity!
Exactly. It's touted as car-free for the wokerati/denserati. The design is really more capitalistic, not "green". They are maximizing the rent collected from the property at an as yet unseen/unknown additional cost to the renters who will necessarily incur inconvenience and higher transportation expenses as a result of the inconvenience.
At the Culdesac site, the developers are blending two ideas that usually have nothing to do with each other. The project is both an “infill” development that aims to sleeve itself into the urban landscape, and a master-planned community that recalls a Disney exhibition or a golf-and-condos parcel in Florida.
So calling it resort-style living (and cost) is apropos.
... and for those urbanophiles that ignore everything except the built-form, they might want to start examining the legal structure - and consequences of the same in real life - for the places they promote. The NYT article further notes:
The development’s park, shops and co-working spaces will all be open to the public, and every penny spent on site, whether from a tenant’s rent check or an outsider’s bar tab, will filter up to the same company.
Walk a quarter mile in AZ summer heat? Hard Pass. And I see absolutely no reference to indoor, covered parking. No thanks. I'm not interested in cooking myself in the Arizona sun. And screw renting. There's a reason all the Casinos on the Las Vegas Strip are either connected indoors or connected by monorail.
Last edited by albert648; 07-24-2023 at 06:14 PM..
American society is culturally rooted in individual ownership of the land. European society is culturally rooted in most of the land belonging to the nobility, the crown or the church. As both societies urbanize, Americans retain their penchant for thinking of themselves as landowners, while Europeans have no qualms about thinking of some other concentration of power as the landowner. In the 21st century we no longer have nobles or peasants (my handle excepted), but the sentiment remains, and is reflected in deliberate national policy choices.
I think the above comment is very astute. Europe and America evolved in very different ways and there is nothing wrong with that at all.
Exactly. It's touted as car-free for the wokerati/denserati. The design is really more capitalistic, not "green". They are maximizing the rent collected from the property at an as yet unseen/unknown additional cost to the renters who will necessarily incur inconvenience and higher transportation expenses as a result of the inconvenience.
At the Culdesac site, the developers are blending two ideas that usually have nothing to do with each other. The project is both an “infill” development that aims to sleeve itself into the urban landscape, and a master-planned community that recalls a Disney exhibition or a golf-and-condos parcel in Florida.
So calling it resort-style living (and cost) is apropos.
... and for those urbanophiles that ignore everything except the built-form, they might want to start examining the legal structure - and consequences of the same in real life - for the places they promote. The NYT article further notes:
The development’s park, shops and co-working spaces will all be open to the public, and every penny spent on site, whether from a tenant’s rent check or an outsider’s bar tab, will filter up to the same company.
No wonder they want to make accessibility difficult...
If they are building the retail spaces, why shouldn't they profit from it? I don't get what your objection is. It sounds like you work for the auto industry.
Accessibility is not "difficult" since it is adjacent to a light rail station, and there will be car sharing and other transportation options and discounts. On the contrary they are making it highly accessible.
The location has a Walk Score of 64 (Somewhat walkable), Transit score of 57 (Good transit), and bike score of 71 (Very bikeable). Not optimal, but not bad for the Phoenix area. Hot in the summer but you don't have to worry about falling on ice in the winter. Just a couple of rail stops away is the ASU campus with lots of amenities. And north of the area is Tempe Town Lake which is a beautiful urban recreation area, with bike paths and rental boats.
I would like to live in a community like this if there were one in my area. I'd love to be able to ditch my car. And I remember Erma Bombeck on TV a long time ago, talking about living in Sun City, and keeping oven mitts in her car so she wouldn't burn her hands on the steering wheel. What about the rest of her? Cars aren't exactly fun to drive in Phoenix when you realize you can bake cookies on the dashboard.
What's rather impractical about a car-free community?
There is nothing more practical than being able to walk directly from the apartment to the grocery store or Kindergarten with the baby stroller. Or when you can take the child for a walk without having to worry about a car running over them.
You can't ignore him either. He is living RENT FREE in your head too.
Not really, he is getting a very limited amount of my attention in this forum, even if it doesn't look like sometimes. But even if I respond to every of his stupid posts with a few small paragraphs, most of the time I am thinking about counterarguments of other users who have really something substantial to say.
For instance I can't take it seriously if he argues, that the term "city" is a strictly legal term or that all else equal adding housing to a place doesn't reduce the housing prices or that average values have no meaning. The silliness of his arguments is endless and it is no intellectual challenge for me to discuss this. It's boring for my brain and that's not the reason why I am here. I want to exchange reasonable arguments and what he is saying all the time is cringe.
If you have a differing opinion about urban planning, ok go on and tell me your arguments against density or whatever, but don't come up with silly arguments like this.
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