Casual friend lied about college degree to get job (job offer, applying, interview)
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Recently, a casual buddy of mine explained that he lied about having a college degree for a job that he wound up getting. Apparently it came up, or rather it didn't come up, in his background check, so the company asked for some sort of verification. I kid you not, he told me that he photoshopped his name onto a degree certificate and sent it to the company and that was all they needed. No questions asked and a decent paying, remote job in the bag.
As someone who went through the grueling process of earning a degree and paying it all off on my own, I wasn't sure how to process this. Obviously, I'm happy for my friend and I truly think the entire hiring system is broken and biased against a lot of deserving people. I posted about it on a sub on reddit, and the general consensus was applause and praise for this bold action. There were lots of sentiments that college is a giant scam and this was, in fact, the right thing to do. I'm kinda beside myself and disappointed, because honesty and integrity are core values of mine. Yet, reddit made me feel like I was the dope for even questioning this. I also feel kind of stupid for earning a degree when it seems so easy to fake it.
Is my friend a 'Robin Hood' of job seekers, or is this pretty grimy behavior?
Maybe somewhere in the middle?
I totally get how you might feel like the dope...BUT your degree is based on your knowledge, perseverance, and 'how to'. You know that in your heart. You worked hard, and no one can take that away from you.
Sure...your aquaintance did a bold thing, and probably...it won't come back to bite him in the butt...but it might. And your buddy has demonstrated that he's quite adept and lying and deceiving...it kind of tells ME that I'd keep that person at arm's length...or if not at arm's length, I know that that friend is comfortable with deceit. Maybe he's deceitful in other areas of his life too. Maybe count yourself lucky that you got a forewarning. (Shrugging shoulders.)
Funny thing about it is that he tried to pull this stunt with a large, reputable aerospace company several months back. They were about to move forward with his application contingent upon a background check, but then I guess he decided to withdraw before it got to that point since he knew he lied. Maybe he hadn't come up with the idea to photoshop the degree yet. Desperate times, desperate measures? But still, wow!
Yeah, that's not gonna fly (pardon the pun) at an aerospace firm with significant security considerations. But if the guy is just doing some generic job like, say, office manager at a widget factory where the only practical function of a degree requirement is to constrict the applicant pool... I wouldn't lose any sleep over someone finding a way past such an artificial barrier other than through the narrow little gate.
I totally get how you might feel like the dope...BUT your degree is based on your knowledge, perseverance, and 'how to'. You know that in your heart. You worked hard, and no one can take that away from you.
Sure...your aquaintance did a bold thing, and probably...it won't come back to bite him in the butt...but it might. And your buddy has demonstrated that he's quite adept and lying and deceiving...it kind of tells ME that I'd keep that person at arm's length...or if not at arm's length, I know that that friend is comfortable with deceit. Maybe he's deceitful in other areas of his life too. Maybe count yourself lucky that you got a forewarning. (Shrugging shoulders.)
Among other things, it has absolutely made me reconsider how I view the relationship. Not only about the trust as it relates to me, but who I want to surround myself with. I know at this point, he will likely not be any more than a casual sports watching buddy.
...And some employers actually make an effort to check. Years ago, I was doing support staff work for a graduate program in nursing which was part of a University. One day, I answered the phone and it was a woman who was checking an applicant's resume. The applicant, whom I'll refer to as "Jane Doe" claimed that she got a PhD in nursing from said University. There was no PhD program in nursing there. In fact, they had only very recently added a MS in nursing and they only accepted a very small number of students. Thus, I was familiar with the names of every person not only who finished the program but those currently attending. I told the woman who called about "Jane Doe" that first of all, the university didn't have a PhD in nursing and second, no one named "Jane Doe" ever was enrolled in any graduate nursing programs. Then she asked if it was possible if "Jane Doe" had a PhD in another area of study at the university. I told her I wouldn't know as the university was big. She thanked me and said "Just as I suspected".
Figuring, this call was a one off, I let the faculty members know of the phone call. None of them ever heard of "Jane Doe". Well...a few months later, I got yet another call from a different employer asking about "Jane Doe" and if "Jane Doe" got a PhD in nursing there. I went through the whole spiel...even added that she wasn't the first to ask about "Jane Doe".
So...some employers do take background checks seriously. Looking back, it was good considering that if "Jane Doe" had been hired, one had to hope she wasn't having any contacts with patients
I hadn't thought about "Jane Doe" in years. This thread had me thinking about her. Her real name wasn't a common one so I may do some googling to see what comes up. Hopefully, she isn't working in the nursing field.
Recently, a casual buddy of mine explained that he lied about having a college degree for a job that he wound up getting. Apparently it came up, or rather it didn't come up, in his background check, so the company asked for some sort of verification. I kid you not, he told me that he photoshopped his name onto a degree certificate and sent it to the company and that was all they needed. No questions asked and a decent paying, remote job in the bag.
As someone who went through the grueling process of earning a degree and paying it all off on my own, I wasn't sure how to process this. Obviously, I'm happy for my friend and I truly think the entire hiring system is broken and biased against a lot of deserving people. I posted about it on a sub on reddit, and the general consensus was applause and praise for this bold action. There were lots of sentiments that college is a giant scam and this was, in fact, the right thing to do. I'm kinda beside myself and disappointed, because honesty and integrity are core values of mine. Yet, reddit made me feel like I was the dope for even questioning this. I also feel kind of stupid for earning a degree when it seems so easy to fake it.
Is my friend a 'Robin Hood' of job seekers, or is this pretty grimy behavior?
I'd move him from the friend to the acquaintance category. He is fundamentally dishonest and I'd really not want to have much to do with that person. At the core of it, the main thing is that you get to look at yourself in the mirror and know that you are not that guy. That's all the really matters at the end of the day.
As a former HR manager, albeit in the highly restrictive Defense industry, I used to be the person who called on every suitable applicant...back before the internet. Once they passed my review, then the names were passed to contractors who did further background checks. IF the applicant was hired, all of this material was redone...before we submitted for a very expensive security clearance. I have come across way more faked degree/job history and even lies about age than I can remember. Everything is done online and very quickly now, and with photoshop etc probably easier to do, hoping that someone drops the ball.
I eventually was working at a very large defense contractor and was contacted by someone at DISCO who did clearances and they found an anomaly while doing a TS background on a long time employee. He had lied about a job quite a few years back. He was fired for this, even after a long history of great work. His security clearance, which is everything in that industry, was revoked. So yes some things can bite you in the ass....I heard he took up house painting.
Recently, a casual buddy of mine explained that he lied about having a college degree for a job that he wound up getting. Apparently it came up, or rather it didn't come up, in his background check, so the company asked for some sort of verification. I kid you not, he told me that he photoshopped his name onto a degree certificate and sent it to the company and that was all they needed. No questions asked and a decent paying, remote job in the bag.
As someone who went through the grueling process of earning a degree and paying it all off on my own, I wasn't sure how to process this. Obviously, I'm happy for my friend and I truly think the entire hiring system is broken and biased against a lot of deserving people. I posted about it on a sub on reddit, and the general consensus was applause and praise for this bold action. There were lots of sentiments that college is a giant scam and this was, in fact, the right thing to do. I'm kinda beside myself and disappointed, because honesty and integrity are core values of mine. Yet, reddit made me feel like I was the dope for even questioning this. I also feel kind of stupid for earning a degree when it seems so easy to fake it.
Is my friend a 'Robin Hood' of job seekers, or is this pretty grimy behavior?
I'll go on the record as saying it's unethical to lie to get a job. I grew up in a time when most people told the truth, at least when it mattered. In my own perception, things were much better back then, people had more stable friendships and valued other human beings. Now it seems, it's "me me me". I also believe employers should be honest and transparent too, but two wrongs don't make a right.
Is my friend a 'Robin Hood' of job seekers, or is this pretty grimy behavior?
I happen to believe it is grimy behavior.
Not because college degrees are the best way to separate the wheat from the chaff. They aren't.
Not because some employer's hiring system happens to be broken. Some are.
Not because someone feels they're the best candidate for the job. They might be.
IMHO excuses (rationalizations?) like those above are fall backs applied by perpetual whiners who expect things to be handed to them.
It's grimy because it is dishonest and unethical. Especially when it is so purely self-serving. Competition may be dog-eat-dog but that doesn't mean it has to be dishonest. Even if this guy happens to be some as yet undiscovered genius, it shouldn't take very long for that to come to light no matter where he starts.
If I found out that a colleague told such a whopper I'd lose all respect for them, would never trust them, and wouldn't have their back if it ever came up.
Last edited by Parnassia; 11-08-2023 at 05:46 PM..
I happen to believe it is grimy behavior. Not because college degrees are the best way to separate the wheat from the chaff (they aren't), not because some employer's hiring system happens to be broken (some are), not because he is actually the best candidate for the job (he might be) but because it is dishonest and unethical. Especially when it is so purely self-serving. Competition may be dog-eat-dog but that doesn't mean it has to be dishonest. Even if he happens to turn out to be some as yet undiscovered genius, it shouldn't take very long for that to come to light. If I found out that a colleague told such a whopper I'd lose all respect for them, would never trust them, and wouldn't have their back if it ever came up.
That hits the nail on the head for me, too.
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